Looking for guidance

[jeffdilbeck]

Yeah. But even more so. The incessant defining and story telling about themselves and others. These kinds of statements:

I know him, he always does X.
I ate cookies, this made me feel a lot better.
I need to get real shit faced tonight to make me feel better.
This movie made me feel so good.
I need a cigarette. They calm 'me' down.
You have always been this way.
He has always been this way.
I am into blah blah blah.
I'm the kind of dude that likes his blah, big, blah.
This other person never comes up with a plan, I plan stuff, make things happen.
I'm going to be somebody.
This is wrecking my life.
You need to get a life.
I am special.
I'm one of those people that....
He is just a bad seed.
Etc.

Yeah.

None of that stuff is true.

[Brian.Hales]

I notice it constantly in me...

[jeffdilbeck]

Ramana said: Hold onto the the 'I' thought until you no longer feel separate from God. This is perfect actually.
There really is NO self.

All it takes is to burn that little bit of glue that holds this idea together.
Check some potentially helpful enlightening quotes:

Years and years ago, you got curious about having a personality and decided to play with the possibility. You’ve experimented with dozens of character traits over the years to figure out what 'shape' your personality should have. But all this has been like decorating an imaginary Christmas tree. There never was anything to hang those qualities on. If you look really closely — really honestly- you’ll discover that the truth is that there never was a you to begin with.

The “I” does not wake up, since it does not exist. It is seen that the only place that an “I” exists is in a thought about oneself (a self-image) that arises from time to time. A thought happens, an I-thought happens, and then another thought happens that says something like, “I just had a thought.” And all this happens with no actual, personal self being there. Do you see this? The I-thought happens frequently enough for it to arise and claim arising thought as its own. The frequently arising I-thought, and the identification with it, is an old habit learned when you were a toddler. But this can be seen — and thus disidentified from.

The mind is playing a great trick — which is believed — that the individual is the author of their life. We have never gone directly looking to find this “you,” which is supposedly a separate entity that is controlling and directing your life, just accepting this is true. But this “you” cannot be found if we go directly looking for it because it does not exist. Life is just happening by itself. You don’t exist separate from life, but as life’s experiences. There is no loss experienced on seeing this because the belief in a separate “you” causes all suffering.

The illusion of “me” is very convincing. But it cannot stand up to examination. Once the mind sees how it’s created, it ceases to have power. It’s like Santa — once you know he is not real, you’ll never write a letter to Santa again. And what happens to Santa when the truth is realized?

Look at a university. All it is, is a bunch of buildings, with certain types of people, with certain things being thought there. The label “university” is put on this area, and the feel of it being a university becomes very real, almost like an entity in itself. But there is only a bunch of buildings there. Now take your life, your limbs, head, brain, blood, guts, memories, thoughts, and feelings. All this stuff very much exists and is very real, but when all this stuff references itself and uses language like “me,” “myself,” and “I,” over time something that seems real appears, a feeling of ownership over all that — a feeling of control, a feeling of “I am my name,” “This is me.” But truthfully, there’s nothing more there than the brain, the blood, the guts, the thoughts, the memories, and so on.

[Brian.Hales]

I don't know man... I see the thoughts... I see they don't reference anything tangible or real, but there seems to still be doubt of what is seen. Why can I have a clear understanding that there is no I, but at the same time continue behaving as if there is? Is behavior not indicative of realization? One day it seems crystal clear, the next it's gone. It's so frustrating.

[jeffdilbeck]

The behavior that you have right now is indicative of realization, my friend. :)

Check this out, let me know what you think about it. Start at page 1, and just read through the abiding and non-abiding awakening part.

http://books.google.com/books?id=nFF8XY ... &q&f=false

also, check out this.

http://youtu.be/8Biv_8xjj8E

love,
Jeff

[Brian.Hales]

That video was incredible. I would love to do the camera experiment. It's amazing that the sense of the self can be displaced so easily...
The one with Jennifer Anniston was interesting too. Over the last few days I have been experimenting with how I conceptualizes the world around me, and how language seems to veil the direct perception of it. I walk around throughout the day looking at things like say a tree. Then I say aloud or in my head the word "Tree". As I am listening to the word "Tree", I notice that the word (a mouth noise) is obviously not a tree. If done right, the senses open wide to the direct felt experience of the tree. The play of the tree suchness on the eyes, ears, nose, and skin. Or even if you want, your tongue lol. It has been very interesting, and can be done with anything. So when I saw that Jennifer Anniston experiment it, it made sense. The direct experience of life may be being clouded by the conceptualization of it. It makes sense because when exposed to a new thing or experience the senses are wide open, but when that thing or experience is familiar, its not as interesting. H

[Brian.Hales]

Oh and I don't think I have any more questions. It seems pretty obvious that this quest of understanding is a solo one. Thank you for all of your pointing and all of your time. It's been a huge help to be able to converse with another person about this. The seeds are sown, and are beginning to sprout.

Thank you so much,
Brian

[jeffdilbeck]

So do you think there is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

[Brian.Hales]

I can only exist as a fantasy. It was all a dream.

[jeffdilbeck]

Would you please explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works?

[Brian.Hales]

Early in our childhood people around us start telling us who and what we are. We start developing an idea in mind, a concept, an image, and a feeling. This concept starts the story, because everyone knows to have a story you need to have characters, so we start developing our character. We try all kinds of different characters on for size like changing clothes, and the people around us tell us whether or not these clothes are acceptable to wear. In my personal story, I was never quite sure what clothes to wear, so I chose to try not to be noticed at all. Anyway after quite a bit of time has gone by, this character role that we are playing begins to be hypnotized into a belief that the character is in fact who we are. We're thrust into the spotlight (or in most people's case, as an extra in the background) on the grand stage of the Globe Theatre. The I is totally believed to be this silly little actor, and our true nature is almost totally forgotten. You may ask, what is our true nature, and to that I say completely with all honesty "I don't know", but when I look it's there. Life can't be understood through language, because language is already once removed from life. If you asked me what is life, I might say "my car in the driveway". Your mind might try and try to figure out what in the hell that means, but most likely will go round and round with the concepts and just become more confused. The only way to know life is directly through the senses. Anyway I'm digressing.
So like I was leading up to, this image of ourselves then gets mixed up with the feeling of ourselves, which we just can't quite place. So we feel like there is this "me" (some might call it the soul) that sits apart and HAS feelings, emotions, thoughts, senses, arms, legs, and heads. But in truth there actually is nobody separate that HAS those things. Those things just exist all by themselves, and not only that, but are actually doing every single one of the strange things they do all by themselves.
That's what I got in a nutshell anyway.

[jeffdilbeck]

Yes. ;)

Another one:

First, think of a forest and trees. Is a tree separate from a forest?

Is anything really separate from anything else? Or is life just life-ing?

Love

[Brian.Hales]

Only a mind full to the brim with conceptual ideas could sever a tree from a forest. Not one thing in what we call the universe could exist separate from anything else. It all goes together.
I constantly think about and imagine Plato's quote "time is the moving image of eternity". I'm not exactly sure of how he imagined it, but I like to imagine it as One inseparable cosmos swirling in and out of itself within the confines of the eternal now moment.
I like to sit and listen. I try as hard as I can to find myself separate than the things I hear. The only way that I can is if I imagine me to be.
That being said, the behaviors and ways of thinking of everyone around me seem to reinforce the idea that everything is separate. I guess that's why I like being secluded so much.

[jeffdilbeck]

How does it feel to see through the illusion of the desperate self, as compared to before seeing this?

[Brian.Hales]

Right now it feels great, but as with waking up from a long nights sleep, sometimes your eyes fall back shut. The good news is that they are inevitably going to open and stay open.