Let’s get this over with

[Daveop]

No…there may not be bliss or joy, but there usually a shift of some description…be it a sense of feeling lighter or even a feeling of relief? There is a stark difference between not caring and not minding…which is it for you? When you say the impetus has left, are you saying that the seeking is no longer?

There's no more seeking. No sense of lacking something to search for. What would even gain it? Not caring and not minding sound like the same thing really. There's no emotion at all, flat, blank. There's definitely no more thinking all of this is happening to someone. It's just going on with no control. Absolutely no desire to do anything, even type this, I'm just showing up to wrap it up.

I did feel something strange in my heart for my spouse yesterday, so it's not like all emotion is lost. It's just different.

What is memory exactly?

A thought about a history.

What is the memory ‘made of’?

Consciousness/experience/this.

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘memory’ thought?

One talks about a prior time, the other doesn't. The context of a prior time may go unspoken, like it's unspoken/inferred that thoughts are ABOUT a thinker.

WHEN does the memory actually appear?

Now.

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘memory’ thought refers to something that has happened?

Verb tense. "They WERE at the park. He SAID that to me." Even if there's no language it feels like thoughts use the same sense of past tense.

Or if you're asking to prove it exactly, you can't.

Then, look at a thought about the future.
What is the future thought ‘made of’?

Consciousness. Thought.

WHEN does the future thought appear?

Now.

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘future’ thought?

Verb tense again. "I WILL go to bed..."

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘future’ thought refers to something that will happen?

It can't be known that any future will happen.

Then let’s compare a thought about the past and a thought about the future.
What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?
If there is a difference, how is that difference known exactly?

The only difference is more thought about which is which.

The only time is now and all else is imagined.

Thanks for helping me out, Kay. I know it has been rough, thanks for sticking through.

[forgetmenot]

Hi Dave,

No…there may not be bliss or joy, but there usually a shift of some description…be it a sense of feeling lighter or even a feeling of relief? There is a stark difference between not caring and not minding…which is it for you? When you say the impetus has left, are you saying that the seeking is no longer?

There's no more seeking. No sense of lacking something to search for. What would even gain it? Not caring and not minding sound like the same thing really. There's no emotion at all, flat, blank. There's definitely no more thinking all of this is happening to someone. It's just going on with no control. Absolutely no desire to do anything, even type this, I'm just showing up to wrap it up.

Wonderful! :)

What is the memory ‘made of’?

Consciousness/experience/this.

The question was pointing to more about memory being made of thought. A memory is simply a thought with a different label.

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘memory’ thought?

One talks about a prior time, the other doesn't. The context of a prior time may go unspoken, like it's unspoken/inferred that thoughts are ABOUT a thinker.

So is there any difference between a general thought and a memory thought…or are they both AE of thought?

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘memory’ thought refers to something that has happened?

Or if you're asking to prove it exactly, you can't.

Exactly.

Then, look at a thought about the future.
What is the future thought ‘made of’?

Consciousness. Thought.

It is simply made of thought, and is content of thought.

Then let’s compare a thought about the past and a thought about the future.
What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?
If there is a difference, how is that difference known exactly?

The only difference is more thought about which is which.
The only time is now and all else is imagined.

Yep, the actual experience of thought isn't any different just because the content of the thought is different.

Thanks for helping me out, Kay. I know it has been rough, thanks for sticking through.

You are most welcome.

There are some final questions which I will give you. It is a way of making sure that my pointing is clear in order for you to be clear that there is no self as it is thought to be, and then we can wrap this thread up.

Can you answer the following questions with some detail please, and answer what's true for you rather than any sort of 'ideal' answer. Also please provide examples where asked.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how things happen and how things work.

b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

6) Anything to add?

Kay

[Daveop]

So is there any difference between a general thought and a memory thought…or are they both AE of thought?

No, both AE of thought.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

No, it's just a thought. Nothing in AE is a self, or individually separate in any way.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

"As I see it now," it doesn't start anywhere, nothing does. Reality is just here and sometimes it shows up with a self illusion.

In the story, it's learned from parents when they assign a name to a body and teach names of objects, including "my" objects. This teaches the child to think of itself as autonomous, and the world as separate things.

The illusion really takes off when parents say "What were you thinking?" This teaches kids that they're supposed to think before each action, and that they control what they think and do. And that some actions are wrong and shouldn't happen... a lifetime of suffering ensues as they blame themselves for "mistakes" that they failed to think about or control properly.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue? Please report from the past few days.

Like a lump on a log. There's just no inclination to do anything, chase after anything. It's okay to just do nothing. There's no worries, which is remarkable. Breathing and other bodily sensations are somehow relaxing and enjoyable. There's a sense of peace to everything.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over; made you look?

The question was incidental, I think. After the Doug Harding exercise I spent at least an hour questioning myself. At one point I noticed the thought "But there has to be someone who is seeing this" matched up with other thoughts like "But there has to be someone thinking this" etc and I realized that they all pointed to an unknown person who was supposed to be the lynchpin of all of them, none of them could hold up on their own. So it was simple to look and see no one in the middle there. This felt like a release.

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How does it work? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how things happen and how things work.

There's really no control over anything. It would be like a cog thinking it has control over the machine. Not that there are parts.

I have been putting off a project for a year and I did it this morning. There wasn't any decision to do it, just seeing the tools get picked up and the thought "Oh, this is finally happening now." Everything takes care of itself like that. Things work out.

b) What are you responsible for? Give examples from your own recent experiences to how this works.

Nothing. What a relief!

I was watching a TV show yesterday. Before, there would have been this sense of the show being something I didn't control, but I have some influence over what happens in the rest of the room. Now, it was obvious everything was happening just like the TV show. It was all the same show.

I'm not even responsible for watching the show, it just happens.

6) Anything to add?

I still can't answer my own questions! But it doesn't matter. They weren't really mine to begin with.

Thanks Kay.

[forgetmenot]

Hello Dave,

It was really lovely reading your responses and to read that there is a sense of peace to everything.

In order for you to avail yourself of other LU resources, I am going to submit your post to other guides who will assess your responses so as to make sure my guiding is clear. It is a good way of making sure that I am pointing clearly. They may have further questions for you. Once everything is clear, you will be invited to join LU's Facebook groups via a private message sent from the forum. You can decide whether you wish to join or not. You can always contact me via the forum if you feel you want further guiding or simply want to chat about all of this. I will contact you as soon as I have heard back from the other guides.

Kay

[forgetmenot]

Hi Dave,

There are no further questions for you....it seems my pointing is clear - always good to know. Please keep an eye out for an email from the forum informing you of a PM. The email will also provide a link to the PM. The PM has an invitation to join LU's FB groups and provides other links as well.

It was lovely guiding you and I thank you for your willingness and openness to LOOK. I enjoyed my short foray from retirement! As I mentioned previously, if you would like further guiding or have any questions that arise...please send me a PM via the forum...I am more than happy to correspond with you. If you would like to connect via FB...I am more than happy to do so.

I wish you the very best.

Sending love,
Kay