Freedom

[Katydidnext]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
I understand there to be no fixed "self" or permanent self-identity. That I have created a complex idea of me, of who I am, which thoughts and memories seem to uphold. Indeed most of my thoughts seem to be shoring up this idea of self.
When I look to see where this self is, then there is nothing there, only thoughts, ideas or views.

What are you looking for at LU?
I am sure there is no "self" but am not sure that I have fully seen through it. I have read that you will know undoubtedly when you have seen through the illusion of self but I am not sure if I am there yet. I would appreciate guidance to see whether I have seen through this illusion or not yet.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
I am hoping to be asked questions which will guide and point me to look at my experiences in a particular way to explore "selfing", the way the self arises, what triggers this process and to finally see that there is no such thing as self. To be free of self-clinging and seeing the workings of craving and aversion more clearly.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
I am a practising, Buddhist and have been on a spiritual journey for over 15years within this tradition. I have a daily meditation practice which has helped me to see the workings of the mind more clearly and has helped me to develop more positive mental states. I would say that all of my life I have been on a quest for spiritual truths; a search for fundamental truth and an intuitive feeling that there was something more to life. So far, Buddhism seems to have given some answers to that search. I am open to other ideas. More recently I have focussed looking at the "self" in meditation practice, what is it I am attaching to - looking at views, thoughts and emotions .

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
10

[Bananafish]

Hi Katydidnext. :)
My name is Bananafish, one of the guides in this forum.

I'd be more than glad to help you, if that's ok for you.



To begin with, could you tell where "self" is?
Would you point to it with your index finger? Where did you point to?


Warm regards,

Bananafish

[Katydidnext]

Hello Bananafish,
That conjures up an interesting image!
Thanks for being willing to guide.
You asked "Where is self?"
I cannot locate any sense of self in the body but if I were to point to a place I guess I would point to the middle of my forehead between my eyes - which is where what I call awareness seems to be present but there is no form with it. My sense of self is a mental construct within that awareness
hope that makes sense.
kind regards
Katy

[Bananafish]

Hi Katy. :) Nice to meet you!


Did you actually do the pointing?
If not, please do, and tell me where you pointed to.


Just tell me where, ok?


Best wishes,


Bananafish

[Katydidnext]

Hi,
Ok. I actually put my hand on my heart + then pointed to my heart area.
kind regards
Katy

[Bananafish]

Hi Katy. :)

Is there any particular feeling in that area?
Would you feel it and describe in details?

Is there anything there that relates to self?

[Katydidnext]

Hello Bananafish,
There is a feeling of warmth and tenderness and a subtle outwardflow of "energy" like reaching out
This feels both intimate and non-personal so me and not me at the same time. So yes a sense of my heart or the essence of me but also a feeling of this being more than me and something universal. I am trying not to put a label onto it.
warm regards
Katy

[Bananafish]

Is it something concrete, limited in
space and time, separate from everything else?

[Katydidnext]

No it is not concrete and not limited in any way. It is not separate from everything else either. I find that very moving,tears have arisen.

[Bananafish]

:)


Please get familiar with that feeling,
and describe it more. Please write as
much as you can.


Is it something you’ve taken yourself
to be for the whole life?

[Bananafish]

Also, could you see if that is
only in the heart area? Where else
can you find it?

[Katydidnext]

I am finding this very tender. The feeling is of tenderness, intimacy, connection.... it feels like it is the best of me ... which is the best of all human beings...there is a heart wish to be more connected, a sense of longing
I think this longing has been there all of my life and in a way intimately part of me
Can't say any more than this

[Katydidnext]

not just in the heart, it suffuses my whole being - body/mind/awareness - there is no division

[Bananafish]

Thanks. :)

Now, what and where is the one that is feeling it?

[Katydidnext]

The one that is feeling it is not separate from the feeling - it is as if it is subsumed within the feeling. I look for a sense of me but it is not there until I start thinking "where is the one"? then the thought arises "it is not there" - then memory of the feeling as if recreating it and "me".
There was no separation between me and the experience, until I started thinking about it. Until I started to describe it, put it into words or analyse it.