Entering into oneness

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:44 pm

Hi Sarah,
Thanks for reaching out. Sorry I haven't been responding. My mind keeps getting caught in a downward spiral so I backed off from it.
Exercise
Sit and explore your self. That sense of being. Of living. Describe it to me the way it presents itself now.
Wide expansiveness. Jolts of terror. Thoughts that try to explain, control or categorize my experience that immediately lead to a sense of everything seizing up - like trying to shift into a gear that no longer works and the engine stalling. Awareness of the sensation of my breath and the sounds around me. Touching a deep sense of peace, then fear and sadness. Surges of adrenaline, the urgent need to do something. Just being feels intolerable and threatening. Sensations of tension in my body.

Not sure where to go from here... thanks for your support.
Moss

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poshgeek
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby poshgeek » Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:17 pm

Thoughts that try to explain, control or categorize my experience
Good. Now how are they YOURS? What qualifies them as such?

And how would you describe your „self“ to me right now? It’s ok if it feels the same as at the beginning of this journey. Just look again and describe it like I‘d never heard it before.


I‘ll write as often as I can, maybe we can speed this up if it’s that bad for you. Does the little exercise to get a grasp of reality help at all?

Love, Sarah
there is no you, there is just looking

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:01 am

Hi Sarah,

I'll try to respond more frequently if you think that's a good strategy.
Does the little exercise to get a grasp of reality help at all?
I spend a lot of my time engaged in this kind of mindfulness practice, paying attention to the world through my senses, and most of the time it actually increases the sense of unreality rather than decreasing it. The more I pay attention , the more transparent and fluid the material world seems. It's been like that for 8 months now. So sadly these kinds of exercises are not grounding and stabilizing as they have been in the past. I'm not sure whether or not there's any meaningful self, but I am sure from my own experience that the consensus reality that humans usually experience, consisting of a solid physical world, is not an absolute truth. That's not something I can hold onto anymore.

As for how the thoughts are "mine", the only sense in which they're mine is that I'm the only one experiencing them. They cause sensations in my body. They focus on the circumstances of my life. I think they often feel like mine because they are familiar. The content is so often recycled, coming round and round again, that they feel as if they belong to me, but they're just popping into and out of existence.
And how would you describe your „self“ to me right now? It’s ok if it feels the same as at the beginning of this journey. Just look again and describe it like I‘d never heard it before.
There's not really any sense of a continuous or distinct self. More like masks that are put on and taken off, roles that I'm accustomed to performing. I'm more and more aware that the things I've been taught to consider "me" -thoughts, emotions, desires, memories, analyses - are completely fluid. More like a liquid than a solid, with no defined edges or anything to that can be claimed as a distinct self.

Thanks Sarah!
Moss

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poshgeek
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby poshgeek » Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:10 pm

Ok, no more praticing that makes things worse.
They cause sensations in my body.
Do you remeber our mind being a crazy labelling machine?
So "body" is a label for some of your direct experience. What about "my" in "my body"? What is it?

Love, Sarah

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:31 am

Hi Sarah,
What about "my" in "my body"? What is it?
In one sense it's mine in the same way that thoughts seem like they're mine : that only I experience the sensations that come from it, and they happen in response to circumstances in my life.
It's mine in that I have some control over what happens to it, I can direct its movement. It seems mine in that I perceive through its physical senes.

But a lot of the time I don't feel bound by the physical body, I feel much bigger than that.

Moss

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poshgeek
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby poshgeek » Thu Jan 25, 2018 1:16 pm

You and I, we both use some sort of computer for this conversation. So if you say „my“ computer, what does that mean? Does the object computer have a property „mine“, like it has a screen size and weight? The word computer is a label, right? What about „my“?
there is no you, there is just looking

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Thu Jan 25, 2018 3:08 pm

The "my" isn't a physical property, but a relationship. So I guess using the word "my" in regards to the body indicates the relationship. Although that implies a "me" to have a relationship with the body...

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poshgeek
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby poshgeek » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:30 pm

Let‘s use the computer for this examination. If you buy the exact same computer as your friend, you would still feel lie one is yours, right? Seeing those 2 exact same computers, could I know which one is yours?

Computer is a label we gave an object. What about “mine”? Isn’t it a label too?
there is no you, there is just looking

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:03 pm

Yes, I guess "mine" is the label for a feeling about or towards something.

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poshgeek
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby poshgeek » Sun Jan 28, 2018 5:06 pm

Moss, I'm down with the flu, I'll get back to you as soon I my head stops hurting :(

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:32 am

Sorry to hear that Sarah. Hope you feel better soon!

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poshgeek
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby poshgeek » Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:50 pm

Hi Moss, I‘m back. But... I had time to think and I realized that I cannot really focus on guiding you at the moment and so I‘m going to find you another guide. So many “I”’s in this sentence :-D
I’m convinced this will speed up the process for you. No giving up now, ok?
Love️, Sarah
there is no you, there is just looking

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Canfora
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Canfora » Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:37 am

Hi Moss!

I'm Canfora and, since Sarah needs some time off, I can be your guide - if that's okay with you.

I assume you are here because you need some help to realize if a separate self is an illusion or not? From a scale from 1 to 10, how real does the illusion seem to you right now?

How have you been feeling regarding being guided?

Is this something that is a priority for you?

Looking forward to our talk,
C

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Wildlichen
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Wildlichen » Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:36 pm

Hi Canfora,

Thanks for stepping in - and also thanks Sarah for all your assistance. Sorry I didn't see this till now.
I assume you are here because you need some help to realize if a separate self is an illusion or not? From a scale from 1 to 10, how real does the illusion seem to you right now?
I'm feeling a bit confused about the process. I'm not sure if there's something to realise that I don't already. Perhaps the illusion is or 1 or 2 out of 10? Perhaps a zero? I don't know how to tell.

I've not been feeling engaged in the process, and I'm not sure if that's due to resistance or because I'm not sure that there's something to "get" about the nature of the self that I haven't already. The unfolding of self actualisation, or whatever you want to call it, is a big priority in my life, but I'm honestly not sure whether this specific process is right now.

I'm interested to hear your thoughts on that!

Thanks,
Moss

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Canfora
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Re: Entering into oneness

Postby Canfora » Wed Feb 07, 2018 12:32 pm

Hi Moss,
I'm feeling a bit confused about the process. I'm not sure if there's something to realise that I don't already. Perhaps the illusion is or 1 or 2 out of 10? Perhaps a zero? I don't know how to tell.
Does this mean you can already see that a separate self is illusory? If you do, how do you see this? Here and now, how do you know a separate self is only an illusion?
I've not been feeling engaged in the process, and I'm not sure if that's due to resistance or because I'm not sure that there's something to "get" about the nature of the self that I haven't already. The unfolding of self actualisation, or whatever you want to call it, is a big priority in my life, but I'm honestly not sure whether this specific process is right now.
Yes, reading your conversation with Sarah I got the feeling that maybe you're having some difficulties or that this isn't something that is top priority for you.
What do you think the nature of self is?
What do you mean when you talk about "self actualization"?

Hug,
C


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