I'd like a guide to help make sure I'm through

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

Hope you are well!

Is there any connection between the felt sensations and the image in the mirror?
Or just thoughts (and/or mental images) suggest that there is?

No the sensations seem disconnected from the image. The thoughts are what connect the felt sensations and the image in the mirror.

While still paying attention to the sensations move one hand and observe the movement from the mirror.
Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and image of movement in the mirror?

There are only thoughts that the sensations are connected to the hand in the mirror.

Now do the same movement with the hand, but this time look at the hand directly, not from the mirror.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and the image ‘of movement’?
Or only thoughts suggest it?

Thoughts are the only thing that connect the felt sensations to the image of movement.

Now, pay attention only to the image in the mirror.
Does the image by itself suggest in any way that is ‘you’ or ‘your body’?
Does the image itself suggest in any way that it is a ‘body’ at all?
Or are there only colours and shapes?

The image by itself does not suggest a “me” or “my body”.
The image by itself does not suggest a body. There is only the image of the body consisting of colors and shapes.

Where the mirror ends, some parts of the body (probably legs) cannot be seen.
Just by the image in the mirror, is there any ‘knowledge’ that there must be legs, or only thoughts and mental images suggest so?

There is only the thoughts suggesting body parts.

Now turn away from the mirror and look forward (don’t look directly to any body parts).
Is there a ‘body’ anywhere when all thoughts and images are ignored, or are there only sensations?

There are only sensations.

Start to walk slowly.
Is there a ‘body walking’, or are there only sensations? Just sensations.
Is there actual experience of ‘walking’ at all? No just sensations, imagery, and thoughts.
Or just THOUGHTS ABOUT ‘walking’? There are only thoughts of walking.
Can such a thing as ‘body’ be found OR just THOUGHTS ABOUT a ‘body’? Just thoughts about a body.
Can such a thing as ‘walking’ be found?

Walking is just the thought of walking.

Are the sensations localized in space, like ‘going through the room’; OR is there only an image that is labelled ‘room’ and appearing sensations without any location?

The sensations are without location and there is only an image that is labelled room.

Thank you Kay!

Love,
Merri

[forgetmenot]

Hey Merri,

Hope you are well!

Yes, I am well…thank you for asking! 

Now, pay attention only to the image in the mirror.
Does the image by itself suggest in any way that is ‘you’ or ‘your body’?
Does the image itself suggest in any way that it is a ‘body’ at all?
Or are there only colours and shapes?
The image by itself does not suggest a “me” or “my body”.

The image by itself does not suggest a body. There is only the image of the body consisting of colors and shapes.

There is no image of a body. All that is appearing is colour (shapes are just different patterns of colour) which an appearing thoughts seems to label as a body.

Where the mirror ends, some parts of the body (probably legs) cannot be seen.

Just by the image in the mirror, is there any ‘knowledge’ that there must be legs, or only thoughts and mental images suggest so?

There is only the thoughts suggesting body parts.

Exactly! So do you actually have a head?
What makes the head a head and a foot a foot?
Can you see the entire body at any one time or only parts of a body?

Are the sensations localized in space, like ‘going through the room’; OR is there only an image that is labelled ‘room’ and appearing sensations without any location?

The sensations are without location and there is only an image that is labelled room.

Lovely yes. Try this out when you go walking in the park!

Is there any experience of there being a ‘you’ in the body?
When you look in the mirror what makes what is seen to be your head, your face, your body?

Love, Kay

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,
I am busy with work and events so I will respond on Friday.
Thank you and have a wonderful evening!

Love,
Merri

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

How are you?
Okay here are my responses.

Exactly! So do you actually have a head?

No, there is no “me” in this head, just a head that is observed.

What makes the head a head and a foot a foot? [/quote]
The head is a head because of the mental images and thoughts labeling a head, and the mental images and thoughts labeling a foot.

Can you see the entire body at any one time or only parts of a body?

No, you cannot see the entire body at any time. There are only parts that can be viewed through a mirror or through the eyes.

Is there any experience of there being a ‘you’ in the body?

No, there are no actual experiences of there being a “me” in the body, just thoughts and physical sensations are being experienced and then interpreted through thoughts of "me" and "mine".

When you look in the mirror what makes what is seen to be your head, your face, your body?

When looking in the mirror, the only thing that makes a head, face and body mine are thoughts that say that it is so.

Thank you Kay! Have a wonderful day!

Love,
Merri

[forgetmenot]

Hey Merri,

Exactly! So do you actually have a head?

No, there is no “me” in this head, just a head that is observed.

Hmmm…Do you actually observe a ‘head’? What is the AE of a ‘head’?

It is generally believed that thoughts are coming from the head somewhere around the forehead. When we try to trace back the origin of a thought, it is often believed that it's coming from the forehead, because the attention automatically goes to the sensation of the forehead. Investigate this carefully as often as you can throughout the day.

What is the forehead in the actual experience?
A sensation + a mental image (of a forehead), right?

So, can a thought come from a sensation?
Can a thought come from a mental image?

Have a very deep look here... the forehead is one of the 'residence' of the SENSE of self. Or rather say, the sensation that is labelled as forehead is believed to be one of the location of the sense of self.

Furthermore, it's also believed that both the 'visual sight' and 'mental images' are coming from the eyes, because when it's investigated the attention automatically goes to the sensation 'of the eyes', and at the same time the image 'of the eyes' appear with it.

So another SENSE of self is linked to the sensation 'of the eyes'.

What are the eyes in the actual experience?
A sensation + a mental image, right?

Can sight come from a sensation?
Can sight come from an image (of the eyes)?

Can a 'mental image' come from a sensation?
Can a 'mental image' come from another mental image (of the eyes)?


Love, Kay

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

Yes, you are definitely targeting the minds hiding places.

Hmmm…Do you actually observe a ‘head’? What is the AE of a ‘head’?

No, I don’t observe a head in AE. What I meant about the observation was that there was the visual observation seeing of a head, not an actual experience of a head.

It is generally believed that thoughts are coming from the head somewhere around the forehead. When we try to trace back the origin of a thought, it is often believed that it's coming from the forehead, because the attention automatically goes to the sensation of the forehead. Investigate this carefully as often as you can throughout the day.

What is the forehead in the actual experience?
A sensation + a mental image (of a forehead), right?

Right!

So, can a thought come from a sensation?

No, thoughts don’t come from sensations. Sensations happen and thoughts happen

Can a thought come from a mental image?

No, thoughts just appear.

Have a very deep look here... the forehead is one of the 'residence' of the SENSE of self. Or rather say, the sensation that is labelled as forehead is believed to be one of the location of the sense of self.

Furthermore, it's also believed that both the 'visual sight' and 'mental images' are coming from the eyes, because when it's investigated the attention automatically goes to the sensation 'of the eyes', and at the same time the image 'of the eyes' appear with it.

So another SENSE of self is linked to the sensation 'of the eyes'.

What are the eyes in the actual experience?
A sensation + a mental image, right?

Right!

Can sight come from a sensation?

No, sight does not come from a sensation.

Can sight come from an image (of the eyes)?

No, sight does not come from an image.

Can a 'mental image' come from a sensation?

No, mental images happen.

Can a 'mental image' come from another mental image (of the eyes)?

No, mental images cannot come from other mental images of the eyes.

Thank you Kay!!

Love,
Merri

[forgetmenot]

Hey Merri,

Hmmm…Do you actually observe a ‘head’? What is the AE of a ‘head’?

No, I don’t observe a head in AE. What I meant about the observation was that there was the visual observation seeing of a head, not an actual experience of a head.

And if you look now, how exactly are you observing your head? Can you actually see your head? And if you look in a mirror and see a head, how is it known that it is a head, and that it is your head and what is the AE?

Here is an image to help point out the difference between actual experience and the stories thought tells about experience.

Thought says that this is Albert Einstein.



Notice that all that's actually present in the picture are some colours. That's all that's there, colour. Thought then labels colour as hair, tongue, moustache, nose, eyes, eyebrows, mouth, ears, face and head and a story about this head being that of Albert Einsten.

The image of Einstein is just a story. There is no Einstein of any kind present. Just a story.
Can you see this?

Now notice that thought is doing this with everything. In fact, without thought, there wouldn't even seem to be any things.

So, can a thought come from a sensation?
No, thoughts don’t come from sensations. Sensations happen and thoughts happen

Can a thought come from a mental image?
No, thoughts just appear.

Can sight come from a sensation?
No, sight does not come from a sensation.

Can sight come from an image (of the eyes)?
No, sight does not come from an image.

Can a 'mental image' come from a sensation?
No, mental images happen.

Can a 'mental image' come from another mental image (of the eyes)?
No, mental images cannot come from other mental images of the eyes.

Great, so next time the idea comes up that there must be a someone thinking because thought points to the sensation in the forehead and that the body’s eyes see, then have a LOOK to see if this is actually the case. Continual LOOKING is important, this is what brings about the perception changes, which then help to bring in the realisation that there is no separate self.

With eyes closed, there is the experience of 'blackness'. There may a bright light, a red glow, sparkly bits or cloudy flecks appearing and disappearing - It really doesn't matter about the specifics. We are simply noticing ‘blackness’.

1) With eyes closed, can you confirm that what is experienced is 'blackness'?
2) Is there anything else in 'seeing' other than 'blackness'?
3) Can what is witnessing the blackness be found?
4) Can a pair of eyes, an 'I' / 'me', a person be found that is witnessing the blackness? Or is there just 'blackness' to be found?
What do you find?

Okay…then with eyes open, look around.

Is there a difference between the ‘blackness’ when eyes are closed and ‘colour’ when eyes are open or are they both simply the appearance of colour?


Love, Kay

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

Okay! Back to work! 😊

And if you look now, how exactly are you observing your head? Can you actually see your head?

I can only see colors of what thoughts interpret as a head.

And if you look in a mirror and see a head, how is it known that it is a head, and that it is your head and what is the AE?

There is no way to know that it is a head and that it is my head. It is all seeing colors and thoughts interpreting in the AE.

The image of Einstein is just a story. There is no Einstein of any kind present. Just a story.
Can you see this?

Yes, a picture is just colors being seen and thoughts come in and interpret.

1) With eyes closed, can you confirm that what is experienced is 'blackness'?

I cannot confirm anything for sure but the AE is that there is an experience of seeing blackness.

2) Is there anything else in 'seeing' other than 'blackness'?

There is the thought interpreting seeing the color as blackness.

3) Can what is witnessing the blackness be found?

No, there is no person that is the witness. Witnessing happens.

4) Can a pair of eyes, an 'I' / 'me', a person be found that is witnessing the blackness?

No, there is no person, just experience experiencing, witnessing witnessing, color being seen.

Or is there just 'blackness' to be found?

There is just the blackness being found.

What do you find?

I find that there is seeing color that thoughts interpret as blackness with red and white filtering into the picture.

Okay…then with eyes open, look around.

Is there a difference between the ‘blackness’ when eyes are closed and ‘colour’ when eyes are open or are they both simply the appearance of colour?

No, there is no difference as they are both the appearance of color with just different thought interpretations.

Thank you so much Kay. Hope you are having a beautiful day!

Love,
Merri

[forgetmenot]

Hello Merri!

What I would like to suggest is that you take some time off and just go back and read your thread from the beginning to now. You can answer the questions in this post first if you like or later. Take a few days reading your thread and if you feel the pull to redo any of the exercises, then follow that pull.

And if you look now, how exactly are you observing your head? Can you actually see your head?

I can only see colors of what thoughts interpret as a head.

It is impossible to see your ‘own’ head. When you look now, you cannot see your head. Just like you are unable to see your eyes, mouth, chin etc. Thoughts are appearing with perhaps a ‘mental’ image of a head, eyes, mouth etc, but can you ACTUALLY see your head?

Can you actually see the back of your neck, can you actually see your back….No…then how can you possibly see your head? You are not looking down at your head…it cannot be seen at all. That is why I asked the next question about looking in a mirror.

And if you look in a mirror and see a head, how is it known that it is a head, and that it is your head and what is the AE?

There is no way to know that it is a head and that it is my head. It is all seeing colors and thoughts interpreting in the AE.

Yes, there is no mirror either. All there is the appearance of colour which thought says is a mirror that is reflecting “my” head and face.

Thought says that the ‘head’ in the mirror is your head, but without a mirror, it is impossible to see your own head.

The image of Einstein is just a story. There is no Einstein of any kind present. Just a story.
Can you see this?

Yes, a picture is just colors being seen and thoughts come in and interpret.

And is there a difference between a picture and what thought calls ‘visual’ sight of Einstein?

1) With eyes closed, can you confirm that what is experienced is 'blackness'?

I cannot confirm anything for sure but the AE is that there is an experience of seeing blackness.

Yes, you can, that is what actual experience is about. In AE can you confirm that what is being ‘experienced’ is blackness, ie the colour labelled black? Actual experience is also a concept, however it is useful in that it’s pointing to what is happening now, in this current moment and not what is imagined.

Checking with AE is the only way to find out if what thought is pointing to is actual, or just pure fantasy!
For every thought that comes up, and to determine whether it is referring to actual experience or whether it is pure fantasy, replace the thought with “blahblahblah” and check whether what it was referring to remains.
Let me know how you go with this.

2) Is there anything else in 'seeing' other than 'blackness'?

There is the thought interpreting seeing the color as blackness.

Yes, thought will automatically appear, but is there anything else needed to ‘see’ the blackness?

3) Can what is witnessing the blackness be found?

No, there is no person that is the witness. Witnessing happens.

Okay, there is no person found witnessing, can anything be found that is witnessing?

4) Can a pair of eyes, an 'I' / 'me', a person be found that is witnessing the blackness?

No, there is no person, just experience experiencing, witnessing witnessing, color being seen.

Colour is not being seen. That means that there would have to be an ‘experiencer’ of the experience which equates to two.

Where is the dividing line between ‘seeing’ and colour? Where does ‘seeing’ end and colour begin?

Or is there just 'blackness' to be found?

There is just the blackness being found.

Yes, so if there is only blackness being found, did you have any choice whatsoever about what you were aware of?

If thoughts say, "I can change what I'm aware of by closing my eyes", and suddenly eyes seem to close, and you are aware of only colour black.
Did you REALLY have any choice about being aware of all of that?
Did you have any choice about being aware of the thoughts, or the apparent closing of eyes, or the colour black?
Could you have chosen not to have thoughts about closing eyes?
Could you have chosen for the colour to be green instead?
If you can’t choose what you are aware of, then what else is there to choose?

Is there a difference between the ‘blackness’ when eyes are closed and ‘colour’ when eyes are open or are they both simply the appearance of colour?

No, there is no difference as they are both the appearance of color with just different thought interpretations.

Yes, lovely. So are there many different colours or just colour appearing which thought then divides and labels as ‘black’, ‘green’, ‘purple’ and so on?

Love, Kay

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

Okay I will review and get back to you in a few days.

Thank you.

Love,

Merri

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

I'm sorry, been very busy. I will send you a message tomorrow (Saturday).

Thank you!!

Love,
Merri

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay,

I am feeling such gratitude for you.
Okay, in answer to your questions...

And is there a difference between a picture and what thought calls ‘visual’ sight of Einstein?

No there is no difference between a picture and the thought of visual sight of Einstein.

Checking with AE is the only way to find out if what thought is pointing to is actual, or just pure fantasy!
For every thought that comes up, and to determine whether it is referring to actual experience or whether it is pure fantasy, replace the thought with “blahblahblah” and check whether what it was referring to remains.
Let me know how you go with this.

That is a great exercise that I will need to do more over time. It is a great way to stop the mind to examine actual experience.

Yes, thought will automatically appear, but is there anything else needed to ‘see’ the blackness?

No, color of the blackness just happens.

Okay, there is no person found witnessing, can anything be found that is witnessing?

No, there is just witnessing or I guess you might call it pure awareness happening.

Where is the dividing line between ‘seeing’ and colour? Where does ‘seeing’ end and colour begin?

Colour is what the mind interprets as “seeing”.

Yes, so if there is only blackness being found, did you have any choice whatsoever about what you were aware of?

No, there is no choice of awareness, awareness in actual experiences happens.

If thoughts say, "I can change what I'm aware of by closing my eyes", and suddenly eyes seem to close, and you are aware of only colour black.
Did you REALLY have any choice about being aware of all of that?

No, there is no choice whatsoever.

Did you have any choice about being aware of the thoughts, or the apparent closing of eyes, or the colour black?

No, there was no choice. Color happens.

Could you have chosen not to have thoughts about closing eyes?

No, there is no choice in thoughts.

Could you have chosen for the colour to be green instead?

Absolutely not. There is no choice in actual experience.

If you can’t choose what you are aware of, then what else is there to choose?

There is nothing to choose, choosing happens, thoughts happen, everything just happens.

Kay, I went over what we wrote and it was very helpful.

Sending love,

Merri

[forgetmenot]

Hey Merri,

I am feeling such gratitude for you.

It is my absolute please to be your guide. So thank you too! :)

Kay, I went over what we wrote and it was very helpful.

Do you have any question at all about what we have covered that you would like to have clarified etc?
Did you have further insights, those penny dropping moments? Would you like to share anything when you reread your thread?

For every thought that comes up, and to determine whether it is referring to actual experience or whether it is pure fantasy, replace the thought with “blahblahblah” and check whether what it was referring to remains.
Let me know how you go with this.

That is a great exercise that I will need to do more over time. It is a great way to stop the mind to examine actual experience.

Yes, it is a great exercise. No matter what thought says, check it with AE and you will get your own answers.

Yes, thought will automatically appear, but is there anything else needed to ‘see’ the blackness?

No, color of the blackness just happens.

Exactly, blackness is not thought into appearance, it just simply IS.
Do you have a choice in what appears when you open your eyes? Do you have a choice to what is seen at your left, at your right or in front?

Okay, there is no person found witnessing, can anything be found that is witnessing?

No, there is just witnessing or I guess you might call it pure awareness happening.

Lovely.

Where is the dividing line between ‘seeing’ and colour? Where does ‘seeing’ end and colour begin?

Colour is what the mind interprets as “seeing”.

Yes, seeing and knowing are one and the same. Seeing of colour and seeing of seeing are one and the same = colour

If you can’t choose what you are aware of, then what else is there to choose?

There is nothing to choose, choosing happens, thoughts happen, everything just happens.

Yes! So are you clear about the idea of decisions and choices?
How do you feel and what do you notice when you see this?

Let’s have a look at time.

There is a general assumption that there is linear time that started (if started at all) somewhere very far in the past and advances to the distant future. The present moment (now) is considered to be a very small fragment of time or an event that is moving forward on this linear time, coming from the past and advancing to the future.

But is there an experience that the ’now’ is moving along the line of time?
Any experience of one ‘moment’ giving way to the next?
Any actual experience of one event following another?

How fast is the ‘present moment’ actually moving?

Just look at 'this moment', can you find a point where it began?

How long does the ‘now’ last?

Where does the ‘now’ start, and where does it end?

When does the ‘now’ exactly become the 'past'?

What is the ‘past’ in actual experience?

So is there actual experience of ‘time’ or thoughts about ‘time’?

Love, Kay

[Love4a11]

Hi Kay!

Do you have any question at all about what we have covered that you would like to have clarified etc?

I don’t have any questions coming up right at this moment. I imagine I could later.

Did you have further insights, those penny dropping moments? Would you like to share anything when you reread your thread?

When I reread the thread, I felt that yes, it is all just happening to all of us. All of these perceptions and thoughts happening, building and building a castle of sand. None of my assumptions about other are correct, and when I looked at other people in the grocery store, the thought of “they are me too” came. Also, “they are just pure awareness as well… and they are color”. And “how do I know what is real?” Cuddling with my husband I felt the feeling of touch and I felt the confusion of not being able to identify his leg. There is a process happening.

Do you have a choice in what appears when you open your eyes?

Absolutely not!

Do you have a choice to what is seen at your left, at your right or in front?

No, there is no choice in what is seen.

Yes! So are you clear about the idea of decisions and choices?

I have some clarity about it but there is also a feeling of confusion about it.

How do you feel and what do you notice when you see this?

There seems to be a feeling of separateness from my choices, that is hard to rectify. Since there is no “me” making the choices then there is no one making the choices? How are choices made? Is it just like a leaf falling from a tree? Is it like the ripple on the water when a stone drops?

Let’s have a look at time.

There is a general assumption that there is linear time that started (if started at all) somewhere very far in the past and advances to the distant future. The present moment (now) is considered to be a very small fragment of time or an event that is moving forward on this linear time, coming from the past and advancing to the future.

But is there an experience that the ’now’ is moving along the line of time?

No, there seems to be is no actual experience of time.

Any experience of one ‘moment’ giving way to the next?

In actual experience it is all just now.

Any actual experience of one event following another?

No, events happen but in AE time is a thought.

How fast is the ‘present moment’ actually moving?

There is no experience of the present moment moving at all.

Just look at 'this moment', can you find a point where it began?

No, I cannot find a beginning.

How long does the ‘now’ last?

Now is constant.

Where does the ‘now’ start, and where does it end?

Now does not begin or end.

When does the ‘now’ exactly become the 'past'?

The past is a thought.

What is the ‘past’ in actual experience?

There is no past in actual experience.

So is there actual experience of ‘time’ or thoughts about ‘time’?

There are only thoughts about “time”.

Okay, Kay this is mind blowing. Thank you.

Love,
Merri

[forgetmenot]

Hey Merri,

I don't know what happened, but I did post a response to you on the day that you posted your response! Thank goodness I write my responses in Word before posting them to the thread, so I had a copy! If I could not post for a couple of days I would let you know - so thank you for your PM asking me if I was okay. This has happened before, where posts just disappear, but thankfully not that often.

Did you have further insights, those penny dropping moments? Would you like to share anything when you reread your thread?

When I reread the thread, I felt that yes, it is all just happening to all of us. All of these perceptions and thoughts happening, building and building a castle of sand. None of my assumptions about other are correct, and when I looked at other people in the grocery store, the thought of “they are me too” came. Also, “they are just pure awareness as well… and they are color”. And “how do I know what is real?” Cuddling with my husband I felt the feeling of touch and I felt the confusion of not being able to identify his leg. There is a process happening.

Here is a video you might find interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dphlhmt ... e=youtu.be

How do you feel and what do you notice when you see this?

There seems to be a feeling of separateness from my choices, that is hard to rectify. Since there is no “me” making the choices then there is no one making the choices? How are choices made? Is it just like a leaf falling from a tree? Is it like the ripple on the water when a stone drops?

The idea of a 'me' making choices won't disappear, it has always been there. There has never been a separate you who is doing, saying, thinking or feeling, so the idea of you doing these won't disappear, it just becomes a deep knowing that they are just simply ideas.

‘Choice’ is just a label that describes specific thoughts, the ensuing thoughts of what the thought ‘choice’ means is the content of that thought. And the content of thought is further thought.

In order for there to be choices there would have to be a subject/object split - something aware of something else. So where does "experience/awareness" end and "experienced/awared" begin? If awareness and awared cannot be separated in any way, then what sense does a "choice" even make?


Another interesting video.

https://vimeo.com/90101368

What is the ‘past’ in actual experience?

There is no past in actual experience.

Yep, the ‘past’ is simply the AE of thought and only points to AE of further thoughts about nothing.

Okay, so let’s look at the idea of memory.

Almost everybody believes that a memory thought is referring to something that has happened.
That a memory thought is a different thought than a non-memory thought.

What is memory exactly? – please don’t go to thought explanation, but just let a memory be there, and look at it…

What is the memory ‘made of’?
WHEN does the memory appear?

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘memory’ thought?

How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘memory’ thought refers to something that has happened?

Then, look at a thought about the future.
What is the future thought ‘made of’?

WHEN does the future thought appear?

What is the exact difference between a ‘general’ thought and a ‘future’ thought?
How is it known EXACTLY that a ‘future’ thought refers to something that will happen?

Then let’s compare a thought about past and a thought about the future.
What is the EXACT difference between the thoughts about past and future?
If there is difference, how that difference is known exactly?

Look at what is actually going on and not what thoughts say… but what actually is.

Love, Kay