Revealing the mystery

[Mysterybox]

Dear Kay,

Have to tell you, it was so crazy when I woke up this morning.. We are staying at our summer cottage at lakeside and we are surrounded by lake. In the morning when I woke up the lake had vanished! It was all white outside our land! Such a strong mist that the world around us had vanished! Had to smile a bit... :D

What is the AE of ‘memory’? In other words, what does the label ‘memory’ point to? Does it point to anything other than the AE of thought?

Yep, I see it now, it points only to a thought.

If you refer back to the ‘time’ exercise, is memory really possible?

No, it is not possible.

Can you find any of these? Can you find *one second ago*?

No, it is always now. All the rest is just a thought. Wow, this really makes life seem fresh and new! I really can't know if "my past" has ever happened to "me"! It is just a thought!

Do you see the analogy that is being drawn?

I see that this is the way we "normally" live our life, but in fact the whole "life" is just a present moment and thoughts about so called past and future. Makes everything seem so simple.. Wow..

Love, Sanna

[forgetmenot]

Hey Sanna,

Have to tell you, it was so crazy when I woke up this morning.. We are staying at our summer cottage at lakeside and we are surrounded by lake. In the morning when I woke up the lake had vanished! It was all white outside our land! Such a strong mist that the world around us had vanished! Had to smile a bit... :D

Haha! So, how was it known that there was a lake there? In that ‘moment’ what was actually appearing was the AE of colour ‘white’ and AE of label/thought ‘ lake and mist’ and further thoughts about ‘lake and mist’.

Can you find any of these? Can you find *one second ago*?

No, it is always now. All the rest is just a thought. Wow, this really makes life seem fresh and new! I really can't know if "my past" has ever happened to "me"! It is just a thought!

“this really makes life seem fresh and new”….how lovely…yes!

Do you see the analogy that is being drawn?

I see that this is the way we "normally" live our life, but in fact the whole "life" is just a present moment and thoughts about so called past and future. Makes everything seem so simple.. Wow..

Yep…it is all so very simple.



Look at this doodle. It looks like there are a lot of things…right?




Life seems to be a gigantic soup of experience that is grouped, categorised and labelled as things. There seems to be a ‘me’ that is ‘here’ that is experiencing things that are ‘out there’. And all those things ‘out there’ are all individual separate things.

None of it is separated except through thought because all of the images present are just one big canvas. Sounds overlap and intrude on each other, and there is a thought that says “I can separate bird song from car horns. Look! See? I've just named them!” But what is actually appearing is sound, with perhaps an image of a bird and an image of a car, and thoughts ABOUT sound appearing as a bird and car!

And thought appears saying “I can separate a cat from a book. See, I’ve just named them!” But what is actually appearing is colour and thoughts ABOUT colour appearing as shapes/images labelled ‘cat’ and ‘book’.

‘Things’ seemingly appear and there are never not things, but have a LOOK to see what is actually appearing.

What separates things? What makes up the borders? Can we pluck a thing out of the scenery in front of us? If not, is it truly separate or is it thought about variation in observed qualities which makes it so?

The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

Love, Kay
xx

[Mysterybox]

Hi Kay,

I will get back to you tomorrow.

Love, Sanna

[Mysterybox]

Hello Kay,

It is getting clearer and clearer that we have surrounded "ourselves" with overwhelming amount of labels/thoughts.. I bet it takes a lot of energy to keep up the play running smoothly :D

The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

The image is a seamless whole and only thing that is separating the objects are label/thoughts.

I've noticed that this looking is happening more and more in daily life: I've been able to just LOOK at things and not all the time giving them labels. Funny feeling :) It somehow helps to just be.

Love, Sanna

[forgetmenot]

Hi Sanna,

[

quote]It is getting clearer and clearer that we have surrounded "ourselves" with overwhelming amount of labels/thoughts.. I bet it takes a lot of energy to keep up the play running smoothly :D
The next time you are watching television, look at the screen and see whether you can pluck an object from the scene. Are there objects existing inside the screen or is the image a seamless whole? What is it that makes it seem as though there are separate objects in the picture? Are they truly separated?

The image is a seamless whole and only thing that is separating the objects are label/thoughts.[/quote]

YES! A map shows how a country is seemingly divided into states and territories. Is the map made of those divisions? Or are those divisions simply the map being the map? The division are the map, but the map is not a division.

I've noticed that this looking is happening more and more in daily life: I've been able to just LOOK at things and not all the time giving them labels. Funny feeling :) It somehow helps to just be.

And it’s not about not having labels or thoughts pop up…but to see them as ‘part’ of the seamless whole as well…as thoughts, just like colour, smell, taste etc just ARE.

Have a really good look at thought. Have you noticed that it doesn't have a voice! You can't hear it. You can't see it. You can't feel it. You can't taste it. You can't smell it; however you are aware of it. Try and describe thought...it is quite impossible! All that needs to happen is to notice what thought says and notice what actually is, there is no need for thoughts to change or disappear.

One last exercise and unless you have any questions, we can then wrap up this thread.

Take a very careful look at this.

Does experience have a location?
If it does, where, exactly, is it located?
For example: Image of hammer hitting thumb, sensation of pain, thought saying, "ouch!!"
Where exactly did all of that happen?
Where was experience located?
Was experience of pain located in the thumb?
Was experience of images located at the thumb and hammer?
Or is experience always "closer" than even the word "here" can convey?
Does anything actually have a location?
How would you know?
What would count as evidence of actual location?

Love, Kay
xx

[Mysterybox]

Dear Kay,

I'm super grateful for your time and help that you've been giving to me. I feel that the change has began but I cannot say how "clear" everything still is..

Try and describe thought...it is quite impossible! All that needs to happen is to notice what thought says and notice what actually is, there is no need for thoughts to change or disappear.

Yep, I get it now that there is nothing "wrong" with the thoughts. It is happening more and more that I just know what is about to happen soon and it will happen. So the intuition is getting heard better. Maybe because there is less "rumble" with the thoughts so they can be heard easier.

One last exercise and unless you have any questions, we can then wrap up this thread.

Do you mean that this guidance is going to finish now?

Does experience have a location?
If it does, where, exactly, is it located?
For example: Image of hammer hitting thumb, sensation of pain, thought saying, "ouch!!"
Where exactly did all of that happen?
Where was experience located?
Was experience of pain located in the thumb?
Was experience of images located at the thumb and hammer?
Or is experience always "closer" than even the word "here" can convey?
Does anything actually have a location?
How would you know?
What would count as evidence of actual location?

No, experience doesn't have a location. There is no "here" or "there", everything just is.
I can't find any evidence that would prove an actual location.

Love, Sanna

[forgetmenot]

Hi Sanna,

Try and describe thought...it is quite impossible! All that needs to happen is to notice what thought says and notice what actually is, there is no need for thoughts to change or disappear.

Yep, I get it now that there is nothing "wrong" with the thoughts. It is happening more and more that I just know what is about to happen soon and it will happen. So the intuition is getting heard better. Maybe because there is less "rumble" with the thoughts so they can be heard easier.

What exactly is “intuition”? How are “intuitive” thoughts and different to any other thought? And what exactly is it that is thinking "intuitive thoughts" or has "intuitive feelings"?

One last exercise and unless you have any questions, we can then wrap up this thread.

Do you mean that this guidance is going to finish now?

Yes, you have clearly seen through the concept of there being a separate self. It is now a matter of diligently LOOKING everyday to see if a separate self can be found whenever the idea appears. LOOKING may need to go on for several months. There are some final questions which I still have to ask, but if you don’t have any further questions…then the aim of this thread has been achieved.

No, experience doesn't have a location. There is no "here" or "there", everything just is.
I can't find any evidence that would prove an actual location.

Great...so it is seen that there is no centre point/location to experience. That there is no inside a ‘me’ and an outside a ‘me’; that there is no 'me' and therefore there is no separation whatsoever.

Love, Kay
xx

[Mysterybox]

Hello Kay,

What exactly is “intuition”? How are “intuitive” thoughts and different to any other thought? And what exactly is it that is thinking "intuitive thoughts" or has "intuitive feelings"?

Intuition is a label that is given to "certain kind of feeling+thought" so actually there is no difference between "intuitive" thoughts and "other" thoughts. No-one is thinking or having intuitive feelings, they just appear like any other thought or feeling. Still using the "old labels" trying to describe something that doesn't need labels... :)

Yes, you have clearly seen through the concept of there being a separate self. It is now a matter of diligently LOOKING everyday to see if a separate self can be found whenever the idea appears. LOOKING may need to go on for several months. There are some final questions which I still have to ask, but if you don’t have any further questions…then the aim of this thread has been achieved.

Thank you Kay for your support, I am so grateful to you for helping me to see and LOOK to the right direction!! I realize that the journey has just begun and LOOKING is happening. Can't find any questions at the moment.

Sending lots of love, Sanna

[forgetmenot]

Hey Sanna,

Posting the final questions. I ask that you answer them with some detail please and to give an example, as requested in Q5.

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
Was there ever?

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience.
Describe it fully as you see it now.

3) How does it feel to see this?
What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.
b) What makes things happen? How does it work?
c) What are you responsible for?
d) Give examples from experience.

6) Anything to add?

Love, Kay
xx

[Mysterybox]

Dear Kay,

1) Is there a separate entity 'self', 'me' 'I', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever?

No, there is not and has never been.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

Illusion of separate self seems to start when labeling begins: when the baby is born it is not separate but after labeling it starts to see things separate from itself. Parents start to give labels to things/to the baby/to other people, so the separation takes form.
The illusion is formed from labels and thoughts: labeling what is visible/heard/sensed/tasted we create an illusion that what is seen/heard/sensed/tasted is somehow "outside" of us.

3) How does it feel to see this?

It feels natural and so simple to just LOOK at things and not all the time give labels and thoughts over thoughts about everything. Realizing that there is no doer, no decider, no controller allows to "let go" and just look.

What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?

Realizing that this has been just the first step and the looking will continue from now-on I feel that the main difference has been the realization that there is no me as a doer and that the simplicity lies on the looking, not labeling.

Please report from the past few days.

Things are happening effortlessly, just having thoughts about "things that should be done" and then just observing how it is happening. Of course it is not happening most of the time but more and more. Less stress, less "me", more looking.

4) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

I feel that this has been coming for a long time. Can't exactly point out what it was that made the final step possible, maybe it was the only possible thing to happen.. And of course it was! Probably it was some of the questions that you asked about separate self/me/I that made me LOOK that there really isn't me and has never been.

5) a) Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control.

These are just thoughts. Can't find them in AE.

b) What makes things happen? How does it work?

Nothing makes things happen, they just happen.

c) What are you responsible for?

Because there is no me so "I" can not be responsible for anything.

d) Give examples from experience.

Experience is only a thought so it is not possible to do this.

6) Anything to add?

No, nothing at the moment.

Love, Sanna

[forgetmenot]

Hi Sanna,

Thank you for your responses.

5) d) Give examples from experience.

Experience is only a thought so it is not possible to do this.

In Q5 (d) the question refers to giving examples of how you have noticed that there is no one deciding, choosing, controlling etc in your day to day activities now. How has that been playing out in life now that you are aware that there is no inherent self. So could you give an example or two please?

Love, Kay
xx

[Mysterybox]

Dear Kay,

I'm feeling that I've taken a huge step "backwards", like I'm not able to LOOK at all :/ Do you have any idea what is this? Or why this is happening? I feel that there is no fear, no anxiety, no resistance.

So I cannot answer your question at the moment, sorry.

-sanna

[forgetmenot]

Hey Sanna,

This huge step 'backwards', is it because you are worried that once this thread has been wrapped up that you feel you will somehow forget that you have 'seen' through the inherent self? What has been seen can not be unseen. Yes, thoughts will appear about doubt and confusion, but are you not totally aware of those thoughts. Can there be any confusion in being absolutely clear when thought, sound, smell, taste, sensation and colour appear? And when LOOKING, because looking will have to continue to happen until it doesn't, that thoughts always appear that try to describe actual experience, and any description about actual experience is just a thought story?

Try and describe the colour labelled green to someone who has no sight, or the sound labelled wind to someone who has no hearing. Try and describe the taste labelled chocolate and the smell labelled coffee. Try and describe the sensation labelled excitement and try and describe a thought! Experience itself ie WHAT IS/THIS...is indescribable.

Thought doesn't stop telling you that it's your car, your job, your body, your craving, your preference, your pain, your happiness, your this and your that. Thought doesn't stop saying something just because it's seen what thoughts are, or seen that there is no inherent self. It's never been any other way. So, perhaps there is an expectation that thoughts about doubt or confusion or whatever will no longer appear?

What is the AE of doubt and the AE of confusion?

What I suggest is that you read through your entire thread from the beginning to the end. Redo some or all of the exercises and when you have done that, let me know how you went.

And from there, answer the Q5 about providing an example. Once that has been answered we can wrap up this thread and you will then be invited to join the LU Aftercare group on Facebook.

Love, Kay
xx

[Mysterybox]

Dear Kay,

Thank you for your responce! You seem to know where I'm coming from :) I started to read the thread again and will get back to you soon.

Thank you for your support, I really appreciate it!

Love, Sanna

[Mysterybox]

Dear Kay,

I read the thread and it felt good to do that. I'm understanding more and more that there has been some strong expectations that are now visible and starting to lose their power. I'm also more aware that the labels still happen to pop-up but it is okey :)

So the last question..

5) d) Give examples from experience.

I am feeling so free now when seeing that "the past" and "the future" are only thoughts. Been able to let go of the stress, planning, controlling, worrying. Just witnessing/seeing/looking how things are happening, taking place how they should be, knowing that everything is as it should be.
I'm seeing that there it no doer but things are just happening. What a relief! Just following the flow of life :)

Love, Sanna