In need of guidance

[Windcatcher]

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
I understand it to be a thought of an I which is no where to be found so a misconception from a young age which has never been questioned as such

What are you looking for at LU?
Clarity I think because I have looked for the I and know it's a thought but still the i keeps coming up in thought which then causes a confusion so I feel perhaps I am not seeing the non existence but intellectualising it

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
Honestly, I have no idea. Feeling a little nervousness as I have always been very introverted and not sure what to expect. I am willing to give it my all and answer any question to the best of my ability

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
Was raised a christian which brought up too many questions with no answers then for last 30 years been through new age, pagan and buddism. Buddism feels closest to what I relate to as far as experiencing

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?: 10

[Bananafish]

Hi windcatcher! I like your forum name. :)


My name is Bananafish, and I'd be more than glad to help you.


It's wonderful that you have no idea about what you expect from the
conversation; heavy load of preconceptions about something like awakening or enlightenment
may prevent the simple understanding of what is here and now.


When you are ready, please reply by telling me
what "you" are. Please don't hesitate to describe it freely.
That would be an important starting point of our inquiry.

Looking forward to your reply. :)


Bananafish

[Windcatcher]

Hi windcatcher! I like your forum name. :)


My name is Bananafish, and I'd be more than glad to help you./quote]

Thank you hehe yours made me giggle as I read it :)

It's wonderful that you have no idea about what you expect from the
conversation; heavy load of preconceptions about something like awakening or enlightenment
may prevent the simple understanding of what is here and now/quote]
I honestly don't know much about either, have read about it but unsure if whether it is just expectations.

When you are ready, please reply by telling me
what "you" are. Please don't hesitate to describe it freely./quote]

Ok deep breath... when I posted originally I felt a confusion which felt like going around and around in circles getting nowhere fast. Then I looked probably for the first time ever and nope no me in body, no me in sensations all that could be seen was experience happening no I experiencing. Keep looking and just see this continuous I thought appearing ugh so frustrating. When I look hehe really look I don't find I anywhere there is no I just experience. Sensations arise... feelings arise... thoughts arise nothing permanent or solid. I am really struggling to explain so hope this is making sense. I thought is just that a thought when I see it the frustration is not there anymore it seems the wanting it not there is causing problems cos who doesn't want it there it is just past of experience doing it's thing.

Thank you so much for taking the time to guide me

[Windcatcher]

Sorry typo... meant part of experience not past

[Windcatcher]

Oh gosh I just rambled on and never really answered what was asked... if you were to ask me to point to me I would probably point to the body

[Bananafish]

Oh gosh I just rambled on and never really answered what was asked... if you were to ask me to point to me I would probably point to the body

No worries, sometimes it actually helps just to ramble. :)

OK, now, do the pointing again and tell me which part of the body
you pointed to?

[Windcatcher]

Thank you :)

I pointed to center of chest.

Not sure if you want me to just stick to specifics or mention thoughts that arise and if that had any relevance.

Have a wonderful weekend

[Bananafish]

Hi Windcatcher!

I pointed to center of chest.

Please do that again, and keep that posture while watching it.
You see you finger, right? Now, try to see what the finger points to.


What's there?

Not sure if you want me to just stick to specifics or mention thoughts that arise and if that had any relevance.

Putting down random thoughts is ok for me, as long as you answer all the questions I post,
although I might ignore some parts of what you wrote which I find
irrelevant to or not helpful for the investigation.

Have a wonderful weekend

You too! :)

[Windcatcher]

I see finger pointing. I can't see "me" I have kept doing this exercise over and over and each time frustration arises. All I see is finger pointing to form and then I close eyes and just feel sensations of pointing to emptiness. There seems to be many disagreeing thoughts popping up labeling so struggling with this a lot

[Bananafish]

I close eyes and just feel sensations of pointing to emptiness.

What's "emptiness"? Is that something more than just an idea?
Is there more to that sensation than just being a sensation?

There seems to be many disagreeing thoughts popping up labeling so struggling with this a lot

Please do the pointing again, and note all the thoughts that popped out during the inquiry.

[Windcatcher]

What's "emptiness"? Is that something more than just an idea?

It's just an idea

Is there more to that sensation than just being a sensation?

Wow, no it's just sensation

Okay redid again. For a short while there is just seeing and sensations then thoughts start to commentate on everything ... like a parrot. Seeing, pointing, breathing.

Sorry this is so long I am taking notes after each attempt so did the pointing again which took longer this time trying to just allow thoughts to be there. There is seeing, hearing sensations and thoughts.

[Windcatcher]

Hello Bananafish

Hope you are well. Been looking again and see the pointing is to a particular sensation in chest area which I have associated with me. Just thought to mention in case it has any use to our investigation

[Bananafish]

Hi windcatcher. :) Thanks for the reply.

Been looking again and see the pointing is to a particular sensation in chest area which I have associated with me.

Can you directly point to a sensation?
Does that sensation have a fixed point?

Can you see it?

What is its quality that makes you associate the sensation with "you"?
How is it different from other sensations?

[Windcatcher]

Absolutely not :)

It feels to be a fixed point in the body (chest area)

No I can't see it

I want to say an alive feeling but I think again that's just an idea.

It's really not, it is just a sensation

[Bananafish]

Absolutely not :)

It feels to be a fixed point in the body (chest area)

No I can't see it

I want to say an alive feeling but I think again that's just an idea.

It's really not, it is just a sensation

Where is the "I" now?