Greetings one and all..

[ray]

Hi Alec,

An interesting turn-around in your last sentence "I'm trying to control the experience."
I assume you noticed that "I" and "control" jumped back in there.

Please continue to be a student of yourself, as it were, to observe when a sense of self and control is here, and when that falls away and you are just being.
There's no need to struggle with this, nor to be tough on yourself for not getting it.

Write back with what turns up.
Ray

[Dawson]

Hi Ray,

Yeah, I recognize moments where there are expectations of how things should and shouldn't be. That creates a sense of trying to control experience. But even then, it's just kind of seen as being pointless. So it falls away and I'm just being for a while. It's cyclical.

Then there's noticing thoughts and seeing how they almost never relate to anything that's happening in direct experience. It's like having bad daytime television on all the time. So there's less interest there. But acutely aware of frustration that's here. That leads to doubt and momentary feelings of being disenchanted. Then it's just being again. And you see how none of that stuff is permanent. It's all just content.

The sense of struggle isn't even always there. It's the character who struggles. When you're just being, everything just is! I'm still seeing that character as me quite a bit though. It's very much back and forth from one to the other.

Kind regards,
Alec

[ray]

Hi Alec,

Seeing that this to fades in and out is quite normal.

"It's all content". That's a good observation. Is there a container as well as the content?

Is there an actual character that struggles? What is a belief and what is real in a that?

All the best
Ray

[Dawson]

Hi Ray,

Is there a container as well as the content?

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by that. A container of the content? No. Content is just constantly arising and is largely influenced by other 'content'.

Is there an actual character that struggles?

No, there isn't an actual character that struggles. Struggles are just thoughts, ideas and expectations about how life should or shouldn't be and those things not aligning with how things actually are. It's just investing in and identifying with those struggles that makes it seem like there is a character who is having them.

What is a belief and what is real in a that?

A belief is an idea about how something is, that isn't based on evidence. Nothing really. Because it's just another concept. Another notion that says something is or should be a certain way instead of just lettings things be as they are.

I had a pretty busy, intense night last night. This morning, I found myself thinking 'How am I feeling?'. Checking up on myself, because I wasn't sure. I realized that it's the attempt to figure out and understand how and what you're feeling the creates this sense of struggle. It's trying to force life to be a certain way.

All the best,
Alec

[ray]

Hi Alec,
I just got back home after being away. I'll reply tomorrow

Ray

[ray]

Hi Alec,
I'm back, hopefully with fewer typos!

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by that. A container of the content? No. Content is just constantly arising and is largely influenced by other 'content'.

I was referring to "content and container" as a metaphor. From what you wrote you do not see there being something that content appears in. That's fine. Some people describe it as everything appearing in awareness (awareness as a container), others say everything appears in awareness, as awareness. This is not critical for seeing through the illusion of self. You can write more on how you see this if you like. Not how you think it is but how you see it.

there isn't an actual character that struggles. Struggles are just thoughts, ideas and expectations about how life should or shouldn't be and those things not aligning with how things actually are. It's just investing in and identifying with those struggles that makes it seem like there is a character who is having them.

That's lovely and clear.

This morning, I found myself thinking 'How am I feeling?'. Checking up on myself, because I wasn't sure. I realized that it's the attempt to figure out and understand how and what you're feeling the creates this sense of struggle. It's trying to force life to be a certain way.

Could you expand on that a bit. What produces the sense of struggle, is it noticing how you feel (without judgment) or is it comparing how you feel with some preferred way of feeling / wishing things to be different to how they are?

Ray

[Dawson]

Hi Ray,

Some people describe it as everything appearing in awareness (awareness as a container), others say everything appears in awareness

Ah ok, I see. Not sure I could add more than what you've put to be honest. Something for me to contemplate.

What produces the sense of struggle

Yes, It's wishing things to be different than how they are. Having this fantasy or expectation that doesn't align with what actually is. It's making that comparison that creates suffering. Also, realizing that you don't really know or own what you're feeling. It's just passing through. It's taken a while to recognize that, but it's helped a lot.

Kind regards,
Alec

[ray]

Hi Alec,

It's wishing things to be different than how they are. Having this fantasy or expectation that doesn't align with what actually is. It's making that comparison that creates suffering. Also, realizing that you don't really know or own what you're feeling. It's just passing through.

So there is a comparison, is that a thought? Also there are feelings passing through which are unowned.
This current experience is a comparison in thought and (a) feeling. Is there an owner of these thoughts and feelings, is there anything for the suffering to stick to?
Look for your answer in current experience, not thought.

Regards,
Ray

[Dawson]

Hi Ray,

Yeah, making the comparison is a thought. There is not an owner of these thoughts and feelings. Sometimes, that's more obvious than others. These past few days though, it's been a lot clearer and obvious. Then like you say, there's nothing for the suffering to stick to. But as long as you think you're the thinker and the one who is feeling the feelings, then it creates this web of bullshit. You get into this game of 'how can I improve my thoughts? how can I improve my feelings?'.

Thanks very much,
Alec

[ray]

how can I improve my thoughts? how can I improve my feelings?'.

Is there anything to be done?

Ray

[Dawson]

No. Doing, along with thoughts and feelings just happen. There's a sense of commitments and practical obligations, but they're just thoughts too. Not based on what is right now.

Thanks Ray,
Alec

[ray]

Doing, along with thoughts and feelings just happen. There's a sense of commitments and practical obligations, but they're just thoughts too. Not based on what is right now.

Cool.

Does it matter that thoughts occur with descriptions and stories that are unrelated to what is right now? If these thougts are believed can you still LOOK anytime and see them for what they are?
Is "I" ever anything other than thought?

Warmly,
Ray

[Dawson]

Does it matter that thoughts occur with descriptions and stories that are unrelated to what is right now?

No, it doesn't matter at all.

If these thougts are believed can you still LOOK anytime and see them for what they are?

Not always, but I can more and more often. Been noticing these past couple of days how a thought arises, and instead of identifying with it, observing it and noticing this associated contraction. Then a moment later, both of them just go.

Is "I" ever anything other than thought?

No. Something which I forget from time to time. But 'I' is always just a thought. Thinking about your opinions or your beliefs, things you have done or want to do. Without that, things just are.

Cheers,
Alec

[ray]

Hi Alec,

Does it matter that thoughts occur with descriptions and stories that are unrelated to what is right now?

No, it doesn't matter at all.

That sounds like a lovely relaxation.

'I' is always just a thought. Thinking about your opinions or your beliefs, things you have done or want to do. Without that, things just are.

Yes, yes, yes!

If these thougts are believed can you still LOOK anytime and see them for what they are?

Not always, but I can more and more often. Been noticing these past couple of days how a thought arises, and instead of identifying with it, observing it and noticing this associated contraction. Then a moment later, both of them just go.

There you go. When a thought and the accompanying contraction are looked at with clear focus they can be seen for what they are.
Do you expect that this will always work, with all thoughts/feelings/contractions?
Does it matter if that's not always the case?
Is it OK if identification with thought still hapens sometimes?

I wonder if you are waiting for an Aha! moment, or for permanent clarity to occur. Sometimes this dawns slowly, but none the less, clearly. That doesn't mean that there will never be another cloudy day!

Ray

[Dawson]

Hi Ray,

Do you expect that this will always work, with all thoughts/feelings/contractions?
Does it matter if that's not always the case?

No, I don't expect that it'll always work and that's okay too. After all, it is a part of life.

Is it OK if identification with thought still hapens sometimes?

Yes, as long as it's acknowledged in some way that that's what's happening.

I wonder if you are waiting for an Aha! moment

If I'm being honest, I guess I am expect something that'll make me go "ohhhh, okay. I get it now". Even that is a thought though, and not one which is permanently underlying all experience. Clarity (for lack of a better word) doesn't feel very stable at the moment. It fluctuates a lot. And there's still this sensation of identifying with the self half the time. Doesn't feel as clear as it should be. I appreciate that there'll be cloudy days though!

It's kinda frustrating because what I talk about is never really the case at the time of writing this. I'm always in this state of just being. And it's looking back at my day in hindsight and seeing how things were. It feels hard to say anything with any conviction these days. Nothing's set in stone.

Thanks very much for you patience and guidance,
Alec