I am ready to begin. Is Ilona available?

[TPT]

no its not possible to get mixed up into thinking there is a self again. no there never was a self. it was created sometime around the time language was formed then we learn about it sometime around 2 or 3 when we start labeling things then it spreads into everything we think, say , and do. self puts a wall between awareness experiencing reality. claiming ownership of life seems responsible for most suffering. i have to admit though something doesnt seem permanently shifted. it was the other night. there was absolutely no doubts then. not sure why their popping up now. maybe there was a expectation of something bigger to happen. not sure

[Ilona]

Whe. You look with whole honesty at what you are expecting now, what is there?
Sometimes shift is very subtle and can't even be recognised while it's happening, only seen when some time passes.
It all unfolds as it should. Trust that.

How does it feel to see that me was never here?

Much love.

[TPT]

Seein me was never here was has been interesting. For a few days there have been lots of peaceful feelings coming up and detachment culminating in that wild energy and sureness about seeing the other night . There's still a feeling of detachment but the last day or two there's been lots of confusion popping up. Not mental confusion just like kinda not being able to find bearings . There's a little fear since that peace isn't really being felt like it was. And I guess that's where the doubt may be coming from. Feels like being in limbo . Just simply don't know if it's been seen through or not.

[Ilona]

If it was seen, then it was, no way you can ever believe that there is a me. But what does it change? Life goes on as it did. Thoughts feelings still happen and life is not all about peace and fuzzy feelings.
You do not wake up from life, but to life. That is just a beginning. And there is so much still to be seen through. So this cleanup time is where all beliefs that have been here connected to I thought are coming up to be dissolved. Everyone's process is different. But this is not a magic pill that gives you peace.

What are you noticing today?
Sending love.

[TPT]

yes there can never be going back to believing in a me again. the feeling i had the other night was much like a invisible man who puts on clothes such as personality , beliefs , ideas, me, I etc... thats why there was this brief what it was like before i was born experience. also i was paying attention to the physical body today and something was noticed. everytime the body did something everything afterwards was a thought about what the body just did. like the finger tapped on the desk and then there was the thought my finger is tapping. everything just happens then it is thought about afterward. the thoughts happen so fast and so conditioned to happen that i had to really pay attention to catch them coming up but they were there . so theres physical reactions then thought then feeling. or it can be thought, then feeling then physical reaction. etc.. it doesnt matter the order what matters is theres no me no matter what order these appear. no director or manager. its like the created self is the map and people are always walking around looking at the map of reality and not reality itself. the I 's and the me's are like a wall between awareness and reality. plus since theres me and i created then that implies ownership which creates problem with believing your thoughts and feelings are true and yours. yes seeing theres no self is no magic pill to permanent peace and bliss but realizing there is no wall blocking reality except the one that was created

[Ilona]

Loved reading your words, yes, resonates here. I can say that seeing is happening and you get where I'm pointing to.
These are some questions for you, answer when ready in full. It will help me see if you crossed with both legs, lol..

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever? 

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

3) How does it feel to see this?

4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it.  

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?


Lots of love!

[TPT]

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever? 

no there is no me just life happening, processes and awareness of those processes. awareness wearing different clothes so to speak. there never was a me.

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

the illusion of seperate self was something that was picked up in early childhood when we begin to label our surrondings which also led to 'me and "I" being created which implied a sense of ownership of life. through years of conditioning and beliefs I and me became a concept which stood in between awareness and life. when not looked at the I runs rampant and creates most of humanitys problems. it is the illusion of ego.

3) How does it feel to see this?

it feels like release. like extraordinary ordinariness , like the most natural thing in the world but something which could change everything from the bottom up

4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it.

i would tell them about labels and how they come about. then i would probably take them outside and show them life living. i would tell them about how labels and this me and I seperate us from life itself, how things happen and then we label them afterward so we have no control over these things. i would tell them that the body and the brain are an organism and that the I that thinks it runs it is an idea.

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

I dont think there was one last bit. just a chipping away over the conversation that eventually revealed nothing. thinking in terms of the body reacting first then the thoughts come in may have been what sealed the deal for me but it was a process

[TPT]

hi ilona, havent talked to you in a couple days. maybe your busy. thats cool. just wanted you to know I was still here, figuratively speaking lol

[Ilona]

TPT, i'm still here and i see that you see where i have been pointing to. so delightful to welcome you to the other side of nonexistent gate.
as you see your name now is in blue and there is a new section open on the forum. and if you are on facebook, find me there https://www.facebook.com/ilona.ciunaite and i'll invite you to the 'aftercare' group.

looking forward to meet you. :)