Requesting a second chance.

[Mav]

Dear Ghata,

Is the looker (the experiencer) the same thing as sound, thoughts, movement, seeing, touching etc? If so what is the acceptable label of that one thing? Life?

Find the looker or experiencer. Wher is he? What does he look like? Is he the same as the one thing? Don't try to find him by thinking about it. When you experience something, look into your first-hand experience. Where is the experiencer?

When I asked this question it was an error. I can't see an experiencer. This is relevant to the question that I asked you in my last post. I asked if there is in fact not much to see. I was struck by the starkness of things when previously I had assumed complexity. Seeing is just one thing, hearing is just one thing, looking is just one thing etc. I have looked at it a lot now. Looking itself does not seem to help once what is seen is established. It is a bit like those people who win the lottery and keep checking the ticket. It is still there, still the same and yes what you thought you saw is what is.

One reason I will continuously slip up in the way I have is because I have to remember stuff. I can't look at all things all the time. Another reason is that I still feel that there is the 'I' to deal with in everyday life just as it was before. So of course I am switching from what appears to be true most of the time to what is true when I focus on it. See, that was another slip. Of course I am not doing those things. That may be an acceptable way of talking but that was said out of habit.

Thank you Ghata.
Mav

[Ghata]

Hi Mav,

Thank you for your reply.

Another reason is that I still feel that there is the 'I' to deal with in everyday life just as it was before. So of course I am switching from what appears to be true most of the time to what is true when I focus on it

Please describe this switching. How does an I come into Everyday Life. What is the difference in everyday life from when you are looking, which border is crossed? Where is this everyday I felt in the body? Which sensations are there? How do you know it is the I?

Sending love,
Ghata

[Mav]

Hello Ghata,
I can never predict what you will ask next.

Please describe this switching. How does an I come into Everyday Life. What is the difference in everyday life from when you are looking, which border is crossed?

Before I answer your questions, to avoid confusion, I just want to make it clear that I am aware that the 'I' is an illusion.

The first state is dominated by the illusion of the 'I'. It is as if I had not learned and had not seen that there is no 'me'. I think this is characterised by constantly being carried away by thoughts, living as if I am the doer, thinker, forgetting completely the work we have done together for most of the time. It is possible to remember that there is no I in this state without seeing it. Of course remembering happens because 'I' think about this everyday and 'I' am interested.

The second state is when there is focus. I think that we call this 'seeing'. Experience happens all the time but it requires focus to 'see'. In this state there is awareness that there is no doer of thought, seeing, smelling, touching, hearing, tasting. It is easy but it is flawed. With lazy looking the experiencer, the looker, of all of this is still assumed.

The third state is when focus is put upon the illusion of the looker. Its possible to see that there is no evidence of this looker/experiencer in direct experience.

It's is only possible to do EITHER the lazy looking OR focus on the illusion of the looker. It hasn't been possible to see the whole picture in one hit because it is not possible to focus on two things at once.

Where is this everyday I felt in the body? Which sensations are there?

That's a tough question. The 'I' can't be felt as it does not exist but I guess being suckered by the 'I' illusion creates a set of sensations that are part of emotions. I could not pick them out. This is thinking about it obviously.

How do you know it is the I?

It isn't. Its the influence of the illusion.
I hope my answers are OK. Thanks for the questions.
Mav

[Ghata]

Hi Mav,

haha, I am unpredictable :-)

Before I answer your questions, to avoid confusion, I just want to make it clear that I am aware that the 'I' is an illusion.

Great! Is this experience or thoughts? Is it an experiential seeing or an intellectual seeing?

It is normal that thoughts come up and identification with them happens again. It has been the basis for living for some decades and it won't cease quickly. You only need to look again. It wouldn't be enough to remember that there is no I - it needs the evidence of seeing it that slowly will change the thinking patterns. Looking for the looker, if it seems to be there, will be done the same way.

In experience, is there any doubt about the self or I being an Illusion?

Sending love,
Ghata
P.S. I will have to take a break as a guide for probably several months, beginning Jan. 16th. Would you like to continue with another guide or go on a break yourself?

[Mav]

Hello Ghata,

Thank you for your questions.
Yes there are doubts when looking. I feel as if I am not doing this right. I worry that I have missed something and you are not aware of it. I can't see clearly. I can only see that the certainty with which I previously based the assumption of 'I' was based on the misconception that there was evidence that there was an 'I'. No 'I' can be found. What is seen however is a lot of confusion and noise. It's not really possible to see the lack of Santa Claus and its not possible to see the lack of 'I'. There is just evidence. I can't see it as I can see this room. I have seen enough to know that there is no I . It is possible to look at each thing that seemed to give the impression of I and see that was a mistake.

But I have not passed through the gate so what is wrong? I don't know. I have asked a few times if I should practise looking but I get no answer, so I just get frustrated with it. There is nothing I can do. So I just sit and wait. If I should look and think everyday I would do this religiously. I just don't know what to do. (please excuse the use of 'I' there).

If you go away and I don't have a guide. What should I do in the meantime? it might be good to not have to post everyday but I would like to be productive. I wish I could see what the instructions were.
Should I meditate? Would that help? Can you give me some instructions for when you are away? My confidence about this is at an all time low. I don't have a clue what is going on or how to proceed.

Best wishes.
Mav

[Ghata]

Dear Mav,

I will answer tomorrow in detail. Yes, looking is always important. It is done without any strain. You notice what is seen, heard, touched or sensed, smelled and tasted, just as you always do. The attention moves to the world of the 5 senses. That is where the gate can be found.

Is there an "I" amongst what is perceived with the 5 senses?

Sending love,
Ghata

[Mav]

Hello Ghata,

Thanks for your reply. Sorry if my last message came across as a little intense. Just knowing for sure that looking should go on helps a lot. I don't find it effortless now. I find it quite stressful. Mainly because it has been done over and over again with no apparent benefit.
I will keep doing it though. I am determined. I am possibly going on a silent retreat in April. I may be able to feel less negative when I am there. I will be able to do a lot of uninterrupted looking. It's a place that I really like.

Is there an "I" amongst what is perceived with the 5 senses?

No. There is no sign of an 'I'.

Best wishes,
Mav.

[Ghata]

Dear Mav,

sorry that my answer is so late, I thought I had already replied but see now that it didn't get sent.

No. There is no sign of an 'I'.

Right. That is really clear :-).

Just knowing for sure that looking should go on helps a lot. I don't find it effortless now. I find it quite stressful. Mainly because it has been done over and over again with no apparent benefit.

Yes, always waiting for something to happen that doesn't is frustrating.

I thought about what would be the best way to proceed when I am on a break and found a guide for you. I will send you details in a pm here in the Forum.

Sending love,
Ghata