A logical mind seeks freedom and joy

[Narracja]

All those answers describe the situation, the background context is what matters if I'd need to communicate the sight to someone else.

I could just say there's "visually distinguishable stuff".

The coins are on a bedsheet, which has stripes on it. Prior experience with how bedsheets and coins are customarily used tells me that the stripes and the background go together, and the coins go together. Should I consider "things on top of the bedframe", they'd all go together...

[EmptySet00]

Does 1+ 1 = 2 or 3?

How do you know?

[Narracja]

Well, as with the earlier examples, this too is context dependent. E.g. 1 plus 1 is 10 in a base-2 context. It can probably be 3 given certain boundary conditions. So: "it depends".

[EmptySet00]

Assuming standard, everyday base 10 numbers and no unusual nonstandard conditions, what is 1 + 1?

How do you know?

[Narracja]

I'd say they are agreed-upon concepts; when I have a thing and add another thing, I have more things (denoted by 2). There are deeper mathematical and logical explanations, of course, which are not thoroughly familiar to me.

[EmptySet00]

Pay close attention to what happens as you do the following:

Write out "138 +74" on a piece of paper in the form you use to hand-calculate the sum, one number under the other with digits lined up.

Then calculate the sum by hand.

Where is the information coming from that you use in this process? Answer based on the experience of doing the sum only.

Try doing other arithmetic problems by hand. Describe how that process happens.

[Narracja]

Pay close attention to what happens as you do the following:

Write out "138 +74" on a piece of paper in the form you use to hand-calculate the sum, one number under the other with digits lined up.

Then calculate the sum by hand.

Where is the information coming from that you use in this process? Answer based on the experience of doing the sum only.

Try doing other arithmetic problems by hand. Describe how that process happens.

There are at least three kinds of processes at play:

1) Especially with small numbers, like 1 and 2 (e.g. 6+2): I treat the numbers like a queue, where they are arranged in order of the magnitude I perceive (e.g. 3 is next in line from 2). Then I take the larger number (here: 6) and add as many 1's as there are in the smaller number to move it forward across the number line (resulting first in 7, then 8).

2) Especially with numbers close to 10, like 8 and 7 (e.g. 7+5): I take the larger number and consider it almost like a cup which can hold 10. Then I deduce enough 1's from the smaller number to "fill the cup", write down how much remains and add it to 10.

3) For some combinations of numbers (e.g. 8+8 or 7+7): I recognise a pattern, such as "8+8=16" and write down the answer. It's like a reaction; seeing those two numbers brings up a memory (of rote learning).

Where is the information coming from that you use in this process?

I have no idea, they just appear. I'm drawn to once again use the term "black box", which spews out stuff but the mechanics of which are hidden... This seems to trigger feelings of frustration.

As to frustration, I owe you an answer to the question (a week or two back) regarding expectations for this exchange. I believe it all comes down to wanting to see something happen for once, seeing any kind of progress.

Here's what I said in November in my first post:

I want to learn to live with uncertainty and be ok with the unforeseen but inevitable shocks the process of living entails.

And as a reply to you asking the same thing:

What do you expect from this exchange?

I expect a small chance of a profound shift in perspective, which could lead to the decrease in suffering described above. Or, at least, an insight as to what this method is, which has worked for so many in the past.

How do you think it will affect you?

My expectation (based on how I think things I tried in the past have affected me), is that there's a big chance it won't affect me at all. Fond of experimentation, I want to take the chance. I wonder if these initial doubts will affect the process itself.

At this point, I'd much like to see that something, anything, changed in a meaningful way. The definition of change is subjective, of course. To borrow from the LU disclaimer:

The method of inquiry used on this site may actually work, unlike many spiritual practices. It will likely change how you regard your self, your relationships, and your world.

If I'd define change as perceiving a meaningful difference between how I saw things in the past and how I see things now, I'd have to say that everything I've ever tried (including the intense 4-week meditation retreat I just took) has either provided a change which is so gradual it's imperceptible, or hasn't really changed much. Both options are associated with feelings of frustration.

What kind of a change would I consider meaningful, then? The old quote about pornography comes to mind; "I don't know how to define it but I know it when I see it". I'm drawn to say it has something to do with a reduction of the omnipresent unsatisfactoriness and discontentment of living. I recognise this is "just" a way to relate to the experience of living but find it very hard to change.

Perhaps expectation is an ill-fitting term; in both this exchange and my meditation/mindfulness practice, I'm mostly driven by 1) hope and 2) the lack of options. I mean, I've tried a lot of things but unsatisfactoriness and discontentment persist. Am I answering your question at all?

[Narracja]

To add; during this exchange I have learnt to notice new things, which I guess is a good thing, but hasn't made much difference in my life so far. I'm very thankful for all your help during the last ten or so months.

[EmptySet00]

No, that was a very good explanation.

It sounds like you're looking for less suffering and more ease. The irony is that to fight suffering is to intensify it.

I don't know if you've done something like this before, but next time you notice suffering, don't resist the experience. Pay attention to exactly what is going on. Allow yourself to be the suffering.

Let me know how it goes.

[Narracja]

Hmm, for some reason I didn't get notified of your answer until now. But I'll have a look. The strategy had admittedly worked wonders with regards to weather and temperature :)

[Narracja]

Ok, I've been doing this exercise where, when I notice suffering, I sort of try to relax into it, like sitting down on a comfy couch. I've used that this tactic before to relax into unpleasant weather like sub-zero temperatures.. So far it looks like this "sinking into" / embracing / enjoying the suffering could actually help alleviate the general suffering condition.

I wonder, what would your approach to "allowing yourself to be the suffering" entail technically?

[Narracja]

I mean, how would you have done it yourself?

[EmptySet00]

I'm having the same problem with notifications. I'll bring it up with the board admins.

Try a different approach: When suffering happens, look for the owner of it, or who the suffering is happening to. Don't just assume you know the answer, really look.

If there seems to be a sufferer, what makes it seem so?

[Narracja]

Hmm... I've been looking at this; very hard to remember to do it when the opportunity arises. Physical pain is perhaps the easiest form of suffering to inspect, as it is often predictable and not intense enough to drive the attention to other directions. It seems like at least this kind of suffering is happening to the body.

[EmptySet00]

Look again - is there pain happening to the body, or is pain an aspect of the experience being labeled body?