Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Bodily sensations, that started yesterday evening and continues today is having like a fist in the stomach punching and punching from the inside. Very strange.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
This Mooji vid also came to me as a gift today. Watching it is quite powerful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3xCmSNb_sc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3xCmSNb_sc
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Glimpse during the morning. Started crying, identifying as a victim, but just a few seconds later the great Joy came and laughed. Paus. Crying starting again - immediate Joy underneith. A feeling of silliness in trying to keep up the belief in the struggling victim while giggling. Feeling really irritated cause it was not going "my way", no attention to the victim. Joy didn't give a damn.
Spending the day struggling. When walking with my horse, there were two big inhales of stillness filling the chest, and this thought came:
- How would it be without this struggling? And I felt how tired I was of it, and how useless it was, and a direct response of a heart vibe.
- What freedom it would be to not have this I! And I realized that it is already the case. Heart vibe again, and seeing the fanatic need to create a someone, around which the thoughts can create a tivoli! And it's all in vain. I saw how there was this body walking with a horse anyway, no matter how much turmoil went on in the thoughts.
I see how I, when going into just "following the body" creates a mind entity that seems to be real that hangs like a bubble over the body following what the body does, having opinions and creating emotions around it. As long as there's identification with that invented entity with a life of its own, there's huge frustration and this feeling of being in a "middle land", since it can't control the body. I see how the "I" is a must for it to exist. The belief of that being the "I" is a must. Otherwise it would just be thoughts coming into awareness.
Looking at my horse.
- Is this "my" horse?
And it was a relaxation and seeing it was just a horse. And this body character taking care of that horse. Life living them both.
Messages keep coming. Now this came on FB:
It's not a matter of letting go—you would if you could. Instead of "Let it go," we should probably say "Let it be."
Jon Kabat-Zinn
So much struggle because of that expression "letting go" and not knowing how to, cause it's the mind that thinks it has to let go! Letting it be is so much more accurate.
I have no expectations that the struggling will just be finished with this. It feels, though, that it can now be allowed in a totally different way. There's tenderness noticing the thoughts.
Underneith is this sense of freedom. An aaaaahhhh! It was already the case....
Haven't got a clue if this now will be a more stable seeing. Something has shifted, though. However, somewhere there's still doubt.
Spending the day struggling. When walking with my horse, there were two big inhales of stillness filling the chest, and this thought came:
- How would it be without this struggling? And I felt how tired I was of it, and how useless it was, and a direct response of a heart vibe.
- What freedom it would be to not have this I! And I realized that it is already the case. Heart vibe again, and seeing the fanatic need to create a someone, around which the thoughts can create a tivoli! And it's all in vain. I saw how there was this body walking with a horse anyway, no matter how much turmoil went on in the thoughts.
I see how I, when going into just "following the body" creates a mind entity that seems to be real that hangs like a bubble over the body following what the body does, having opinions and creating emotions around it. As long as there's identification with that invented entity with a life of its own, there's huge frustration and this feeling of being in a "middle land", since it can't control the body. I see how the "I" is a must for it to exist. The belief of that being the "I" is a must. Otherwise it would just be thoughts coming into awareness.
Looking at my horse.
- Is this "my" horse?
And it was a relaxation and seeing it was just a horse. And this body character taking care of that horse. Life living them both.
Messages keep coming. Now this came on FB:
It's not a matter of letting go—you would if you could. Instead of "Let it go," we should probably say "Let it be."
Jon Kabat-Zinn
So much struggle because of that expression "letting go" and not knowing how to, cause it's the mind that thinks it has to let go! Letting it be is so much more accurate.
I have no expectations that the struggling will just be finished with this. It feels, though, that it can now be allowed in a totally different way. There's tenderness noticing the thoughts.
Underneith is this sense of freedom. An aaaaahhhh! It was already the case....
Haven't got a clue if this now will be a more stable seeing. Something has shifted, though. However, somewhere there's still doubt.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Oh, this strange, funny feeling again, when talking to "others". Talking to a ...?.... believing itself to be a someone although not.... how it expresses itself as 'characters in belief'... and the softness and sweetness talking to them. And the surprise everytime they answer, seeing what it will come up with... Life talking to itself... life listening to itself and its own creations.... =))) And seeing they don't see... The immediate knowing when someone is mind-babbling. That's why this site is so fabulous - being checked by someone seeing that constantly! Patrick, shoot what ever there's left of false belief here! =))))) Shoot!
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Bodily sensations, that started yesterday evening and continues today is having like a fist in the stomach punching and punching from the inside. Very strange.
Last night the same bodily sensations were here also present the whole night long. They were allowed to be fully present, to express themselves in their own way. There were no thoughts trying to analyse, to search for a reason why this sensations were present. There were thougths, just babbling about nothing real.
This bodily sensations are now present in the background and that’s okay. Nothing to be worried about.
Nice to see the process you are going through and to see that you are willing to questioning your beliefs and assumptions.
Some questions to help clearing things up. You don't have to answer separately.
They are all pointing to what is present in the moment, now.
What are you still looking for?
What are you trying to find?
What is not here yet?
Is there something missing?
Is it possible that something is missing in the moment?
Last night the same bodily sensations were here also present the whole night long. They were allowed to be fully present, to express themselves in their own way. There were no thoughts trying to analyse, to search for a reason why this sensations were present. There were thougths, just babbling about nothing real.
This bodily sensations are now present in the background and that’s okay. Nothing to be worried about.
Nice to see the process you are going through and to see that you are willing to questioning your beliefs and assumptions.
Some questions to help clearing things up. You don't have to answer separately.
They are all pointing to what is present in the moment, now.
What are you still looking for?
What are you trying to find?
What is not here yet?
Is there something missing?
Is it possible that something is missing in the moment?
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
What are you still looking for?
What are you trying to find?
What is not here yet?
Is there something missing?
Is it possible that something is missing in the moment?
The resistance gets furious here at times, attacking with tricky questions that 'I now should be able to answer' or it's not for real. I've read some other threads here on LU, and I saw somehere Ilona saying that as long as there's this sense of wobbling the realization haven't hit properly - it's a mentalization going on, or something like that. (Can't find the direct quote). So the thoughts hook on that, harrassing: "This is still not the real deal. This is not stable enough. See, as soon as there's a direct seeing, the mind goes there to "own" it immediately afterwards and you fall for it every time!" and there is a belief in that for a while. It continues ranting on the theme "I'm so stuck in my mind"... and suddenly, instead of TRYING not to believe in it, I give it right! =) Isn't this absolutely true that the the stuckness is just that? It's like putting out a leg and have the mind stumble over it. Direct energetic response, heart, more stillness, and seeing again that it's truly the concept of "I" that is stuck in the concept "mind" cause it can't be anything else. And it needs focus and attention to live, or else it fades and goes quiet. And afterwards punching in stomach... Sorry to share it with you. LOL! On the energetic level we're truly One.
So what am I still looking for? Stability. Don't know if there's still a hidden victim voice "I want this to be stable", or if it's an unseen fear of "losing it" as if there's still a belief in an I owning an experience, or just pure wisdom from earlier actual experiences? The effort of inquiry will still be needed, that's for sure. But a sense it is no longer up to "me" what direction this will go this time - deeper or back to sleep. It's in the hands of Grace. The depths that were seen before are not here yet either. It's very strange to now take a slow step at a time. It's not coming as a "kablaaam" like before with the whole lot of it. So there's still a "knowing" there's soooo much more to discover!
But apart from that... there's a feeling everything is perfectly ok. Nothing missing. This moment is what is and can't be anything else. It's already the case! Now and now and now. =)
What are you trying to find?
What is not here yet?
Is there something missing?
Is it possible that something is missing in the moment?
The resistance gets furious here at times, attacking with tricky questions that 'I now should be able to answer' or it's not for real. I've read some other threads here on LU, and I saw somehere Ilona saying that as long as there's this sense of wobbling the realization haven't hit properly - it's a mentalization going on, or something like that. (Can't find the direct quote). So the thoughts hook on that, harrassing: "This is still not the real deal. This is not stable enough. See, as soon as there's a direct seeing, the mind goes there to "own" it immediately afterwards and you fall for it every time!" and there is a belief in that for a while. It continues ranting on the theme "I'm so stuck in my mind"... and suddenly, instead of TRYING not to believe in it, I give it right! =) Isn't this absolutely true that the the stuckness is just that? It's like putting out a leg and have the mind stumble over it. Direct energetic response, heart, more stillness, and seeing again that it's truly the concept of "I" that is stuck in the concept "mind" cause it can't be anything else. And it needs focus and attention to live, or else it fades and goes quiet. And afterwards punching in stomach... Sorry to share it with you. LOL! On the energetic level we're truly One.
So what am I still looking for? Stability. Don't know if there's still a hidden victim voice "I want this to be stable", or if it's an unseen fear of "losing it" as if there's still a belief in an I owning an experience, or just pure wisdom from earlier actual experiences? The effort of inquiry will still be needed, that's for sure. But a sense it is no longer up to "me" what direction this will go this time - deeper or back to sleep. It's in the hands of Grace. The depths that were seen before are not here yet either. It's very strange to now take a slow step at a time. It's not coming as a "kablaaam" like before with the whole lot of it. So there's still a "knowing" there's soooo much more to discover!
But apart from that... there's a feeling everything is perfectly ok. Nothing missing. This moment is what is and can't be anything else. It's already the case! Now and now and now. =)
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
But apart from that... there's a feeling everything is perfectly ok. Nothing missing. This moment is what is and can't be anything else. It's already the case! Now and now and now. =)
Yes! See this clearly.
Yes! See this clearly.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Sorry, it's just a mind melt down here and it's not pretty. I'll come back when I have something of value to report.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Grateful for this process. It's new. It was given for free last time. This time it's eating itself into the beliefsystem, and I can sense the burning. Life presenting situation after situation where this seeing is "tested". How much is allowed before the "I" starts protesting too intense and the habit of identification takes over. Shame being one thing for example. If this character does something "wrong", it's immediately owned and believed to be "my fault". Inquiry happening faster and faster, though. An ability to let that shame flow through and not create a story around it IS there.
Some magical stuff happening too. (I bet this old master I'm connected to is playing some tricks as usual. Things like this happens around him a lot.) Yesterday just before bedtime, I was moving towards the bed when the legs just turned and changed direction and placed the body in a strange place in the room. I didn't get why it was standing there, until I saw it had placed me so that I could see a mirror in the next room, but the mirror face was all blurry. And the message: What is seen? It's just an image. A body with no particular face. And Plato's metaphore came up. What we perceive as characters are just projected images, shadows, including this one, standing looking at itself. It's not for real, it's just appearing. Forced to face "I" am nobody.
Some magical stuff happening too. (I bet this old master I'm connected to is playing some tricks as usual. Things like this happens around him a lot.) Yesterday just before bedtime, I was moving towards the bed when the legs just turned and changed direction and placed the body in a strange place in the room. I didn't get why it was standing there, until I saw it had placed me so that I could see a mirror in the next room, but the mirror face was all blurry. And the message: What is seen? It's just an image. A body with no particular face. And Plato's metaphore came up. What we perceive as characters are just projected images, shadows, including this one, standing looking at itself. It's not for real, it's just appearing. Forced to face "I" am nobody.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Some magical stuff happening too.
And if it was not magical at all?
Just life showing how ‘you’ are not in control?
But this is also a assumption.
What if this is 'just what happens' and that’s it?
Perfect in the moment it happens.
All the rest are thoughts afterwards trying to give meaning.
And if it was not magical at all?
Just life showing how ‘you’ are not in control?
But this is also a assumption.
What if this is 'just what happens' and that’s it?
Perfect in the moment it happens.
All the rest are thoughts afterwards trying to give meaning.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Yes. The meaning is glued on later. Magical is just another word for mind-boggling events. Existence is a wonder as it is. Brings awe anyway... such events...
The lovemaking is coming back also at times... emptiness loving its forms... Movement, sound, vibration creating like a friction against the background of stillness, silence...
The lovemaking is coming back also at times... emptiness loving its forms... Movement, sound, vibration creating like a friction against the background of stillness, silence...
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Is there really a 'you' in reality?
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Reading through our conversation. Backing on some of your questions where I feel things are bubbling up.
Is there anything trying to protect 'you' ? If so, what?
How is it to know that there is no one in control, that you are completely at the mercy of life itself. How is this for ‘you’? Is this frightening? Or are there other feelings, sensations, emotions coming up?
There's a huge fear here. Thoughts and conclusions based on former experiences that are still believed. A lot of Jesus Christ stuff coming in different ways. I know a teacher once asked something like:
"Are you willing to give up your ideas of what a life 'as reality' will look like? To be completely in the unknown and willing to accept whatever life brings? What if Life wants you to be sick, have no money, or work with something you don't like? Look at Jesus - he was as enlightened as one can be and he got cruzified!" How is it to truly live "Be Thy Will"?
There are so many memories here of this character and body doing outrageous things, socially unacceptable things (for example: mouth saying words of Truth to workshopleaders that wipes them out as fakes in front of the group, transmitting higher frequencies to pretended enlightened satsang holders having them even step off the stage, having hands and arms go out and "heal" people in public without consent, transmitting energies so people lift from their chairs at restaurants etc etc). Things like that when it's doing what it's doing without any "me" having control. People don't understand certain things, and they seem to hate this character, they think it's an ego operating just being a pain in the ass. There are a few realized beings I've been hanging with who have calmed me and said it's "pure", it's just Life operating through this body, it's not ego-driven, no worries, go with it. But the scorn, anger and hatred is taken in here and believed to be about the person, "me", and it's such a sadness around that. Many have urged me to STOP IT immediately, as if I could... It has given me such understanding of the Jesus-story - how it is to stand up for Truth to the cost of being cruzified by others.
It's fucking frightening to let it all just be and let go of the control thoughts! I don't know what it is, but something is trying to protect "me" from this scorn, protect "my" reputation, protect this character from "making a fool out of herself".
So many layers to burn through here! So many layers of cemented and believed "I-thoughts" bubbling up.
Is there really a 'you' in reality?
No. Just a lot of thoughts upon thoughts bringing emotions bringing more interpretations bringing more thoughts, creating illusory entangled self-investment. And the mystery of what the eff is able to believe in that.
Is there anything trying to protect 'you' ? If so, what?
How is it to know that there is no one in control, that you are completely at the mercy of life itself. How is this for ‘you’? Is this frightening? Or are there other feelings, sensations, emotions coming up?
There's a huge fear here. Thoughts and conclusions based on former experiences that are still believed. A lot of Jesus Christ stuff coming in different ways. I know a teacher once asked something like:
"Are you willing to give up your ideas of what a life 'as reality' will look like? To be completely in the unknown and willing to accept whatever life brings? What if Life wants you to be sick, have no money, or work with something you don't like? Look at Jesus - he was as enlightened as one can be and he got cruzified!" How is it to truly live "Be Thy Will"?
There are so many memories here of this character and body doing outrageous things, socially unacceptable things (for example: mouth saying words of Truth to workshopleaders that wipes them out as fakes in front of the group, transmitting higher frequencies to pretended enlightened satsang holders having them even step off the stage, having hands and arms go out and "heal" people in public without consent, transmitting energies so people lift from their chairs at restaurants etc etc). Things like that when it's doing what it's doing without any "me" having control. People don't understand certain things, and they seem to hate this character, they think it's an ego operating just being a pain in the ass. There are a few realized beings I've been hanging with who have calmed me and said it's "pure", it's just Life operating through this body, it's not ego-driven, no worries, go with it. But the scorn, anger and hatred is taken in here and believed to be about the person, "me", and it's such a sadness around that. Many have urged me to STOP IT immediately, as if I could... It has given me such understanding of the Jesus-story - how it is to stand up for Truth to the cost of being cruzified by others.
It's fucking frightening to let it all just be and let go of the control thoughts! I don't know what it is, but something is trying to protect "me" from this scorn, protect "my" reputation, protect this character from "making a fool out of herself".
So many layers to burn through here! So many layers of cemented and believed "I-thoughts" bubbling up.
Is there really a 'you' in reality?
No. Just a lot of thoughts upon thoughts bringing emotions bringing more interpretations bringing more thoughts, creating illusory entangled self-investment. And the mystery of what the eff is able to believe in that.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
So many layers to burn through here! So many layers of cemented and believed "I-thoughts" bubbling up.
Right, that’s what thoughts are doing. Bubbling up and dissolving immediately.
There is nothing to burn through. Just see that it are thoughts and not reality.
Don't focus upon the content. That’s what dissolves the mind-glue.
Is there really a 'you' in reality?
No. Just a lot of thoughts upon thoughts bringing emotions bringing more interpretations bringing more thoughts, creating illusory entangled self-investment.
You see clearly that the ‘you’ is created by thoughts upon thoughts.
Look at this in total honesty! See clearly the implications.
If the ‘you’, the ‘I’ is an illusion, what happens when an illusion is seen through?
Nothing changes, life goes on as it is. No big-bang, no ‘heaven on earth’. Direct experiencing.
Don’t believe anymore your mind-chatter about ‘I’.
One look and it’s gone. See the illusion. That’s all.
Life will unfold by itself. Thrust it.
Right, that’s what thoughts are doing. Bubbling up and dissolving immediately.
There is nothing to burn through. Just see that it are thoughts and not reality.
Don't focus upon the content. That’s what dissolves the mind-glue.
Is there really a 'you' in reality?
No. Just a lot of thoughts upon thoughts bringing emotions bringing more interpretations bringing more thoughts, creating illusory entangled self-investment.
You see clearly that the ‘you’ is created by thoughts upon thoughts.
Look at this in total honesty! See clearly the implications.
If the ‘you’, the ‘I’ is an illusion, what happens when an illusion is seen through?
Nothing changes, life goes on as it is. No big-bang, no ‘heaven on earth’. Direct experiencing.
Don’t believe anymore your mind-chatter about ‘I’.
One look and it’s gone. See the illusion. That’s all.
Life will unfold by itself. Thrust it.
Re: Open invitation, jump in and start the dialogue
Yes. There's just a peace underneith all experiences. It's very much a sense of coming home while everyday life is just what it always was. And so much more joy and smiling. Thoughts become more like objects and even though there's habitual emotional reactions to some "I-thoughts" it's impossible to take them seriously. The emotions are also seen and allowed to run through... The sense of self is no longer confusing. It's also just there. Inquiry happening too. There are moments during the day when inquiry is not happening and habitual thinking happens, but it's experienced as if there's a radio on in the background, no one really listening. I don't even hear what they say.
It's a feeling of falling backwards and always landing safely at home.
It's a feeling of falling backwards and always landing safely at home.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests