Why does oneness elude me?

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Sun Jul 11, 2021 7:24 am

Hi lostpixel,
Is there reality on one hand and someone who test it on other hand?
I'm assuming by 'test' you mean 'taste' or 'experience'? It's a good question. My instinct is that there is some observer/experiencer of some sort, but they're not separate from reality, just a part of it.
Yes, exactly! It is seems that there is someone who perceive reality, but there is just reality. This is the illusion.
So is there someone real who perceive and experience reality? Where can be, somewhere outside reality?

Please, answer each one or two days, if it's possible.

love
lubo

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lostpixel
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby lostpixel » Sun Jul 18, 2021 10:36 am

Hi lubo, apologies for the slow reply, I've been out of town and without my computer for a few days.

I have been investigating this and I think my main sticking point is identification with body sensations, especially in my face (e.g. forehead, eyes, mouth, jaw). Awareness + these body sensations = 'me'. The body sensations make it feel like there's a center point for awareness.

Intellectually I can kind of see why there's no real reason to identify with these more than any other perception/object in awareness, yet in practice this identification is just there and hard to shake. Any advice?

Thanks in advance.

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:19 am

Hi lostpixel,

Ok, let's look these ones:
I have been investigating this and I think my main sticking point is identification with body sensations, especially in my face (e.g. forehead, eyes, mouth, jaw). Awareness + these body sensations = 'me'. The body sensations make it feel like there's a center point for awareness.
Face - you are the face ? Which part is you?
Are you the nose ? Are you in the nose?
Is there an you behind the face?
Can eyes see?
Where are you - behind the eyes?
or you are eyes?

With eyes closed notice:
- Do you disappear?
- How long is a body?

Body sensations - let the finger touch something and notice:
- Where the sensation is happening?
In the finger? Can the finger know that there is a sensation? Are you finger?
Can the face knows that there is a sensation?
Can the body knows that there is a sensation?
The body is an experiencer or the body is experienced?
Can the body start or stop experiencing?
Is there an you who can start or stop experiencing?
there's a center point for awareness.
Where is the exact point?
What is the experience of awareness?

What reality is? Something like this: There are all these things around and I, the awareness am coming here (but from where?) and all the stuff start floating in me? And I start to know them?
Notice colours and sounds - is there awareness and colour and sound ? Without colour and sound what awareness looks like?
Are there feelings + awareness = 2
Awareness + things=2
But what the words - non-dual, Not 2 - point to?

Take your time,
lubo

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lostpixel
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby lostpixel » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:46 pm

Hi lubo, thanks for this.

I've been struggling with this a bit to be honest and feel like I'm hitting a bit of a wall. There's quite a few questions in your last post so I'll just tackle them one by one:
Face - you are the face ? Which part is you? Are you the nose ? Are you in the nose?
No I'm not the face or a part of the face. There is an intimacy and persistence to sensations/energy from the face though, which seem harder to disown. An individual sensation isn't me, but constant sensations in the face make it feel like there's a centre to awareness/experience.
Is there an you behind the face? Can eyes see? Where are you - behind the eyes? or you are eyes?
When I have my eyes open is sometimes does feel like there's a me behind my eyes, but with my eyes shut this feeling goes away.
With eyes closed notice:
- Do you disappear?
- How long is a body?
No I don't disappear. I'm not sure how long the body is, there's just body sensations.
Body sensations - let the finger touch something and notice: - Where the sensation is happening? In the finger? Can the finger know that there is a sensation?
The finger does have nerves so perhaps it does know there is a sensation, I'm not really sure. I'm not my finger so I can't really know.
Can the face knows that there is a sensation? Can the body knows that there is a sensation? The body is an experiencer or the body is experienced?
I don't think we can know if the face or body knows that there is sensation, but 'we' can.
Can the body start or stop experiencing?
Not while we're alive at least.
Is there an you who can start or stop experiencing?
I know the correct non dual response to this is 'no', but for now I feel like there's is a me - but it can't choose to stop experiencing.
Where is the exact point?
With my eyes open it does seem to be centred behind the eyes. With them shut it's more generally in the face - more like a cloud of sensation around the eyes, nose and mouth.
What is the experience of awareness?
I'm not sure how to answer this. All sensation, all perception, everything.
What reality is? Something like this: There are all these things around and I, the awareness am coming here (but from where?) and all the stuff start floating in me? And I start to know them?
Notice colours and sounds - is there awareness and colour and sound ? Without colour and sound what awareness looks like?
Are there feelings + awareness = 2
Awareness + things=2
But what the words - non-dual, Not 2 - point to?
I can see how awareness goes hand in hand with the perceptions/experience itself - they rely on each other, or are the same thing. I don't know what awareness would be without colour or sound etc, but I assume it's be some empty void, or nothing.

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Sun Jul 25, 2021 7:23 am

Hi lostpixel ,
You are doing well, don't worry.
So, let's see this:
I've been struggling with this a bit to be honest and feel like I'm hitting a bit of a wall. There's quite a few questions in your last post so I'll just tackle them one by one
This hitting of the wall means that there is an expectation something to change to become free.
But there is no you even now, you are already free and nothing can change this.
I'm very clear - I - is an illusion. Santa is an illusion also.
You аre waiting for the socks on the fireplace to disappear to make it clear that Santa is a fabrication.
You are waiting sensation, energy around face and etc. to disappear to find that there is no you.
But there is no you, even now, way something should changed to see this?
This investigation is to find - is this sensation really you? or this is just a sensation?
Is this face you? or maybe you are the owner of the face? But where is the owner then?
Again, there is a belief that the I is the face or around the face. OK Lets look is this true, if it's not there, is no reason to believe this any more, am I clear?
So, if someone smash the face that is you, are you smashed or the face is smashed?
If you drink the water from the bottle, the water becomes less, the weight will decrease,, it will be obvious that the water is less, but if the body, that is believed to be you, becomes more or less heavy is this mean that the I becomes more I or less I?
If there is no connection between an I and the weight of the body, does this mean that the body is not the I, or?
Van Gogh cut off his ear, so Van Gogh becomes less Van Gogh, maybe without one letter in the name or what?
We a looking here to find where is the real I, not to change anything .
Read this 2 - 3 times and write what is coming?

With love,
lubo

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lostpixel
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby lostpixel » Sat Jul 31, 2021 11:55 am

Hi lubo, thanks for this, and sorry for the slow reply.

I've read this three times and what came up was imagining if there was no sensation in the face, and imagining I could not see my nose out of my eyes, or any part of my body. I think I'd still feel like some sort of disembodied 'I'.

Why these thoughts, sounds, sights and sensations, and not others? It's like I am some sort of localised experience, or some slice of reality.

When you wake up every morning with the same body isn't it natural to take ownership of it? Not necessarily to consider it to be the same as I (or consciousness) but to have some intensely intimate connection to it.

Doesn't non-duality point to there being no separation between context and content? So no separation between me (as consciousness) and body sensations? So to say 'I am body sensations' is true, as much as it's true to say 'I am everything that's here'?

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Sun Aug 01, 2021 9:26 am

Hi Lostpixel,

I sent you an email.
Do I need to do something in the forum to initiate a video guiding session?
Absolutely no. Just to fix the date and time.
I've read this three times and what came up was imagining if there was no sensation in the face, and imagining I could not see my nose out of my eyes, or any part of my body. I think I'd still feel like some sort of disembodied 'I'
Without imagination notice - Is there someone in the body? Is there someone outside the body?
Why these thoughts, sounds, sights and sensations, and not others?
Excellent question! Notice are there some efforts for all sensations and thoughts to be here , to appear?
Notice do you make something to experience colour? What about a sound?
Notice that thoughts coming after what is experienced? For the example - notice that colour of the door. The door is real. Then notice the thoughts coming This door is this colour, but the thoughts are not the colour, they are just thoughts.
Can you notice at direct experience what is real and what is a content of thoughts/not real?
It's like I am some sort of localised experience, or some slice of reality.
yes but no :)
What if there is one whole reality? And there are no pieces?
Notice the door and the wall. They are separate objects but Is there a reality + door and + a wall or reality appears like a door and wall?
Doesn't non-duality point to there being no separation between context and content? So no separation between me (as consciousness) and body sensations? So to say 'I am body sensations' is true, as much as it's true to say 'I am everything that's here'?
Wonderfull! You are on the right direction.
BUT ! :)
There is no you who is sensation and who is everything. This everything is absolutely unknowable.
Notice the colours. how they appear? Who make it to appear? if this is you can you stop colours to be?
If you are everything, do you know what this everything will looks like before it appears ?

love
lubo

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Fri Aug 27, 2021 7:59 am

Hi LASTpixel ;)

Here it is the exercise:
Get a sheet of paper and draw a line that divides that sheet in half. Label one half 'self' and the other side 'other'. Sit down and start a timer for 5 minutes. Every time you have a thought make a mark on the sheet. If that thought is about the self put a mark on the self side, if it’s about something else, mark the other side. If a thought about food occurs due to feeling hungry, mark that on the self side. Any thought that refers back to a self should go on the self side. (I'm bored, I'm tired, is the door locked (my safety) that video was funny (I was amused), my back hurts, I am frightened) get it?
Let me know how you go and what you notice.

much Love
lubo

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lostpixel
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby lostpixel » Sat Aug 28, 2021 9:23 pm

Hi Lubo, thanks for sharing that exercise. Here's what I wrote down during it:

Self
- Cup of tea. I’m looking forward to having one.
- Thoughts about posting results of exercise to forum
- I have a dull headache
- How much time has passed? Will it end without me having written much down?
- I need to remember to reply to my friend on Facebook today
- Thinking about not being sure if just seeing things appear in imagination is a thought

Other
- With closed eyes, saw moving lines, kinda like railway tracks
- I can hear the kids watching TV in another room. What are they watching? (could potentially be self-related, but if so seemed very subtle)

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Tue Aug 31, 2021 10:04 am

Hi laspixel,
Sorry for delay.
Other
- With closed eyes, saw moving lines, kinda like railway tracks
There is hidden I who sees this :)
- I can hear the kids watching TV in another room. What are they watching? (could potentially be self-related, but if so seemed very subtle)
"I can hear" - is not very subtle :)

Can you notice that EVERY thought is about I/me?
Play with this all day.
Can you notice that every thing that arise, everything that is happening is covered with this kind of thoughts?

love
lubo

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lostpixel
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby lostpixel » Fri Sep 03, 2021 12:06 am

Hi there. Yes, ok. I'll play with this and get back to you.

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Fri Sep 03, 2021 6:48 am

Ok.
And notice also,
Who or what brings information that there is an you who make these thoughts?

:)
lubo

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lostpixel
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby lostpixel » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:17 am

Hi Lubu. I've been a bit quiet lately as I've been busy with other stuff but also questioning how much further I want to go with this guidance/inquiry at this stage. I've decided that I'd prefer to stop and digest this for a while (e.g. weeks or months). I just wanted you to know that I'm very grateful for your guidance, time and energy and that I've had a very positive experience and am appreciative of what you've helped 'me' see, but it just feels right to pause this for a bit.

Much love❤️

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Lubo
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Re: Why does oneness elude me?

Postby Lubo » Fri Sep 17, 2021 7:30 am

Hi Lastpixel,
OK.
Im here.

Love
lubo


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