Desperate to see! Can you help me?

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 12:36 am

Oh, yes, more to come....seeing into the question now. Expect more soon...

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Tue Feb 02, 2016 12:45 am

Great question! Mind is in a tangle! Following is what I have so far. But since you asked for a description in detail....perhaps more time is needed to feel into it?

Part of it was an attempt to comfort an overloaded nervous system. It started happening for me at a young age. The illusion of existing separately and being in control was a way of toning down the experience of life. I could escape into the empty space of "me."
No time like the present. :) That's fine.

Next up...as and when...just share the first response.

How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.


Thank you,
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:05 am

Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works from
your own experience. Describe it fully as you see it now.

As a very young child I remember having a lot of difficulty around thought. I wasn't comfortable with language. I was comfortable with direct experience. But I didn't fit in with conversation. It was like trying to crawl into a small box in order to converse with others. I wanted in on "the" experience of interaction. And here "I" was born. And then, of course, "I" couldn't wait to get out. But now the experience outside the box has new terrain than before I went into the box. There is a feeling of the whole thing growing. But that is not quit right because nothing is happening. This is almost impossible to describe in language!

The separate self is a thought being believed. The emptiness of itself surprises. It is a Jack in the box with no Jack and no box. And not even anyone holding the box. The best I can do is ask questions--"who, what, where?" and in waiting for the answers everything gets seen. There is no answer to this question, no getting it right. It's now a Jack in the box with an endless stream of Jacks and boxes and people carrying boxes.

The illusion of the self. How do I describe a separation that never existed? I get up on the podium and scream about it, trying to make it real so I can show it isn't real?

But these can't be the answers you're looking for. Or that involve the looking since there is no you.

Blindness now lurks where light had been. Suddenly the trembling in the stomach returns. "John is pointing the finger at that spot--something is threatened. It must be an "I". The "I" of trying to get something right....

John! I could give you an endless stream of answers on this one--keep you up all night, or glued to the computer for days.

What is the illusion of the separate self? It is a life lived out of alignment. It is a constant escaping. It is not me or you or anyone. It is a thought being believed for just a moment--giving the appearance of a future and past.

I'm trying not to tell you the things I've heard, how I've heard it described. But those descriptions certainly dance about.

I honestly don't know the answer to your question. Should I keep looking?

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:06 am

Ooops, didn't see you last post. Will work on that one now.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:20 am

its all cool :) - as and when.

Have a lovely day!
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:28 am

How does it feel to see this? What is the difference from before you started this dialogue?
Please report from the past few days.
There's no longer a separation of inner and outer. There is just a wave. Our conversation is a wave, like the sea moving in and out, only there is no in and no out. Before there was a lot of getting stuck. There was fear. Something has been released. Blossoming is occurring. There is direct experience. Everything is me and I am everything. The feelings of the plants growing are my feelings. The feeling of someone looking at me is my feeling. The other is me. I'm it. It's not a concept. It's a verb. It's action, motion, energy, stillness. Constantly changing while not doing anything.

"How does it feel?" Hehehe! Well those feelings are constantly changing. They range from peaceful to ecstatic.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:31 am

LOVELY! :)

Next up:

What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look?

Thank you,
/John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:44 am

I was sitting on the toilet when I read your following post:
I'm not fond of explanations :) or concepts claiming to be true. So, when I say you, i'm talking to the indefinable, unfindable you, that is knowing - and you know instinctively at heart.

This-you you made up.

So we keep it direct, and not seek to placate mind with so-called answers.

Where is the river? In the mountains where the rains gather? in the streams that flow down? In the valley where it meanders through? The splash of a stone thrown? Where is the river?

For river, see you.
It hit me in my stomach and my stomach started shaking. I really wanted to run! My thoughts were all over me with condemnation. And then I realized this was some kind of transmission and that every time I feel threatened, that is what is occurring some kind of transmission from the divine.....something being shown to me, a falseness or blindness being cut away. It hurt like crazy. But it was also the moment. Of course everything that led up to that moment helped. There was a lot of work that went into coming to this point in which I could trust and open. Your attention given to the heart and invitations to open the heart were very helpful. But now I see the whole thing as more of a dance. Nothing pushed me over or made me look. The invitation has been there all my life--sometimes in a violent way, at other times gently. The gentle approach worked better for me. But the truth I see now is that it was simply time.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:55 am

It was simply time. Yep! beautiful.

Ok, one more :) Shoot from the hip.

Describe decision, intention, free will, choice and control. What makes things happen? How
does it work? What are you responsible for? Give examples from experience.


Thank you,
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:58 am

And to get even more specific about it, the following words are the ones that really stuck, that wouldn't let me run:
and you know instinctively at heart.
Because you were right on, I did know instinctively at heart. I didn't know with concepts, understandings, or anything else.

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:07 am

There is no decisions, intentions, fee will, choice, or control. Whatever happens is all part of a movement. When you speak, I answer. Or if there are some thoughts being believed, I might just think instead of answering. There could of course be a myriad of other reasons why I might not answer, but they would all have to do with other waves happening that interfere with the first wave.

I'm not responsible for any of it, and neither is anyone else. It's all just happening.

It is also worth mentioning that these answers are part of this conversation, part of this wave. They would be inappropriate in another conversation, another wave. They are not true. Just part of this wave.

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s-p-a-c-e
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby s-p-a-c-e » Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:12 am

Very nicely put! And to wrap it up...a place to share what shows up...

Anything to add?

Thank you,
John
"The more he looked inside, the more Piglet wasn't there." - A.A.Milne

Author, The Faun's Apprentice - see on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fauns-Apprenti ... B01AR2B63U

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:15 am

What do you mean? Wrap it up for today? Or completely wrap it up? A place to share what shows up? What does this mean?

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:17 am

Sorry you have had to put up with so much of my I-ing.

But one more: I love you John.

Had to say it.

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Jillian1
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Re: Desperate to see! Can you help me?

Postby Jillian1 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:24 am

Oh yeah, something else to add.....Am I going to turn blue? :)


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