Help me become free

This is a read-only part of the forum. All threads where seeing happens are stored here and come from this forum, the Facebook guiding area and various LU blogs. The complete list, sorted by guide, contains all links. The archives include threads of those that came to LU already seeing as well.
User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:48 pm

Can you point and locate where these thoughts appear ?
These thoughts seems to appear from nowhere! A point of nothingness at the middle of my body, around my heart? Like a bubble that pops up and then dissolves back into nothing. A space of nothingness at the centre of my being.
Can you control these thoughts, emotions, sensations changing ?
I feel like I can begin the process of a thought, like there is an intention that happens before the thought that then leads to the thought. But the actual appearance and dissolution of the thought and the sensations I can't.

Right now I have a lot of sadness and I don't think I can control it. There are sensations and emotions of sadness, then I can try to think something about the sadness or analyze it in some way, but I can't control that these sensations are here and changing slightly. I can remove my resistance to them which makes them stronger, makes me want to cry. I have a choice in allowing them to pass through, I think. Rather than resisting them and pushing them down.
when you open eyes and see colours and shapes, do you need to do anything in order to see the view?
I need to actually look. If I just open my eyes I generally don't notice because I am thinking something. When you say open your eyes if I do that and intentionally look, I don't need to do anything further to see the view.
do you need to do anything to hear sounds?
I just have to pay attention to sounds. Before you asked there were sounds but I was not noticing, now that I am paying attention I don't have to do anything further, sounds are here.
how about touching things, is the sensation there by itself or you switch it on and off?
The sensation is there. I just have to pay attention to it and it's there.
taste, smell, are you in charge of that or it's simply there?
They are there, oftentimes I forget! But they are there when I am willing to pay attention to taste and smell.
do you move the blood and make heart beat?
No I do not. These things just happen by themselves.
do you need to manage other bodily funtions or not?
They will happen, but my attention does make a difference. Sometimes I think I have to pee but I have learned that I don't really have to, if I wait the urge goes away until later. Also if I am constrained and stressed my bowels do not work as well.
What can you control at will ?
I can control where I place my attention and I can control my intention. This is very difficult for me though, this is where I struggle. For example, I have an intention to build a mindfulness and yoga therapy practice. There are tasks I need to do like posting on my webpage, sending out e-mails, doing marketing on my packages, etc. in order to make this happen.

But, many times I wonder if this is the best use of my energy. I already have a full time job and I have a family. I have opportunities to work on myself and be space for others at all times. I can always bring more compassion, service and love to everything I do. So do I even need to do this business project? Or do I just forget about it? I don't always know what to do, in fact I never really know if what I am doing is the right thing, unless I am just being present with myself or others.

It's like I can't plan. I can only be. This is frustrating! How do I know what to spend time on? Do I only choose one thing at a time in the moment and let go of planning? I let the business thing figure itself out? I don't control it? Should my intention be to do this business?

Or maybe my intention stays at the true purpose of the business, to bring compassion, service and love to everything I do. To help reduce suffering in any way I can. To share the gift of mindfulness and presence with the world through every moment. Maybe that is enough. And if I'm called to do the packages or e-mails or whatever great, but if not, that's ok too.

Is that how we do life? I'm not sure!!!

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:38 am

Can you point and locate where these thoughts appear ?

These thoughts seems to appear from nowhere! A point of nothingness at the middle of my body, around my heart? Like a bubble that pops up and then dissolves back into nothing. A space of nothingness at the centre of my being.
Yes they appear from nowhere and dissolves to unknown..Further comments will be coming from thinking..
Let's see:

How do you know " a space of nothingness" ?
What is the actual experience center of my being" ?


Direct experiences are listed below:
Sights
Sounds
Touch sensations
Smells
Tastes
+Thoughts (not the content of the thought)

Can you touch smell, hear, seei taste "a center of being" ?

Or you can only think about it ?



Can you control these thoughts, emotions, sensations changing ?

I feel like I can begin the process of a thought, like there is an intention that happens before the thought that then leads to the thought. But the actual appearance and dissolution of the thought and the sensations I can't.

Right now I have a lot of sadness and I don't think I can control it. There are sensations and emotions of sadness, then I can try to think something about the sadness or analyze it in some way, but I can't control that these sensations are here and changing slightly. I can remove my resistance to them which makes them stronger, makes me want to cry. I have a choice in allowing them to pass through, I think. Rather than resisting them and pushing them down.
It is absolutely impossible for a "you" to even begin the process of a thought, we will look at these on the following posts..


when you open eyes and see colours and shapes, do you need to do anything in order to see the view?

I need to actually look. If I just open my eyes I generally don't notice because I am thinking something. When you say open your eyes if I do that and intentionally look, I don't need to do anything further to see the view.
Sure seeing starts when eyes are opened. No extra effort is needed to see.

do you need to do anything to hear sounds?
I just have to pay attention to sounds. Before you asked there were sounds but I was not noticing, now that I am paying attention I don't have to do anything further, sounds are here.
Same as seeing..

how about touching things, is the sensation there by itself or you switch it on and off?
The sensation is there. I just have to pay attention to it and it's there.
Look!
Do you really have to do anything for sensation to be there and noticed ?
You don't say "my dear attention now go to sensation please!" Right ?
Isn't it also attention happen it self ?
Where is this "i" paying attention ? Сan you locate it ?


do you need to manage other bodily funtions or not?

They will happen, but my attention does make a difference. Sometimes I think I have to pee but I have learned that I don't really have to, if I wait the urge goes away until later. Also if I am constrained and stressed my bowels do not work as well.
Can you tell me how to control this attention ?
Is it possible to ?
Look!
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:55 am

After looking to my previous questions marked blue on the previous post let's now take a look how this attention works..

Sit down and relax. Observe this focus of attention... see how it wanders. It simply focusses on whatever happens in the moment.
It can focus on a car sound coming from the street..A shadow appearing..People talking..A body function such as tiredness or hunger..

Now it might focus on thought. You might even "get lost in thought"...

Did you decide to get lost in thought? Or did it simply happen?

When "you" come back to present moment experiencing, did you control how/when this happened?

Can you control thought any more than you can control sound, can you control the focus on thought any more then the focus on sound?

Or is this simply a constant flow, a constant change and movement..?


Simply sit for 10min or so and observe. Note what you find.

Sending love
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:26 pm

Adil,

This process is so helpful! I am so grateful!

Here are my answers to your blue questions and the exercise:
How do you know " a space of nothingness" ?
What is the actual experience center of my being" ?
A softness, open hole, circle shape, pulsating, softening, pleasant, deep, empty, expanding out - the circle seems to be of one size but then can expand and take over even my whole body. An expansion out and then in. Sometimes opens and closes.
Can you touch smell, hear, seei taste "a center of being" ?
No smell, I can almost hear a small hum but it is very quiet. It almost smells like flowers or feels the way I feel when I smell flowers. No taste but seems to have some sort of texture, soft like a bunny.
Or you can only think about it ?
I think it is all thoughts about it. When I'm really in it I can't think about it. As soon as the thoughts start I'm not really there I'm just observing.
Look!
Do you really have to do anything for sensation to be there and noticed ?
You don't say "my dear attention now go to sensation please!" Right ?
Isn't it also attention happen it self ?
Where is this "i" paying attention ? Сan you locate it ?
I don't have to do anything to notice sensation. I think what is happening is I'm usually distracted with thought so I don't notice sensation. It is always happening.

Attention. Does it happen by itself? I guess so! It's always there also I think! It's just in the background, always there!

I don't think there is an I paying attention. Attention is there, sensations are there, and the thought of I just distracts me from this truth.
Can you tell me how to control this attention ?
Is it possible to ?
Look!
I can't control the attention. I can just notice it. It is already there.
Did you decide to get lost in thought? Or did it simply happen?
It happened. It just starts to flow and I get lost in it, thinking there is something for me to do and to figure out. I guess not :-(
When "you" come back to present moment experiencing, did you control how/when this happened?
I think there is a moment when I notice I am lost in thought, and I can ask myself if it's helpful, and then choose to let go of the thoughts and come back to awareness.

Is this not me either? Maybe just awareness seeps in and I see that the thoughts are just thoughts? Or awareness sees? Am I not even there at all? Is it all just awareness? Does it evolve in its own way, in its own time?

I think I can choose the focus of awareness, like coming back to something in the present moment (breath, sensation), or switch the train of thought from worry / negative to trusting / positive. No?
Can you control thought any more than you can control sound, can you control the focus on thought any more then the focus on sound?
Maybe not! Maybe thought it just there! And maybe all the resistance I feel in my body is wanting so badly to control my thinking, when really it's going to come and go at will, and I can only rest in awareness.
Or is this simply a constant flow, a constant change and movement..?
Constant flow. Constant change and movement. I observe. I observe. I observe.

10 minute observation:
Brilliant!

I saw how I don't control anything. Not even thoughts. Awareness is just there, everything is flowing. I can get caught up, and then let it go.

Then all of a sudden a thought will pop out of nowhere, there was a thought about a small step I could take re my business, so after my observation I wrote it down to do later. Nothing more to do.

I don't do anything. All the tension I feel in my body is me trying to do something! Trying so hard to control thought, to control sensation, to make something happen and to make me into something.

There is only awareness, I can't even say that I am the awareness because the awareness is just there. Everything is just flowing.

So relaxing!

I've scheduled 10 minutes daily to do this observation exercise - "Do Nothing." It's not even meditation because I'm just looking, not trying to focus or anything at all. It is very freeing!

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:06 pm

Ok Dear Paula
Thank you for your answers..
Let's look,
ow do you know " a space of nothingness" ?
What is the actual experience center of my being" ?
A softness, open hole, circle shape, pulsating, softening, pleasant, deep, empty, expanding out - the circle seems to be of one size but then can expand and take over even my whole body. An expansion out and then in. Sometimes opens and closes.

Can you touch smell, hear, seei taste "a center of being" ?
No smell, I can almost hear a small hum but it is very quiet. It almost smells like flowers or feels the way I feel when I smell flowers. No taste but seems to have some sort of texture, soft like a bunny.
Here what i have asked from you was LOOKING! Plain looking to what is.
So see things actually what they are.
So all the definiton that you can make is more thinking.
So just look!
Direct experience of "center of being" is only a thought.
All definitions are thought. We cannot rely on thought content because it does not always say what is really here and now.
We will be making more exercises for you to focus on what is really here and now and make you focus on Actual Experiences. (AE)
I think I can choose the focus of awareness, like coming back to something in the present moment (breath, sensation), or switch the train of thought from worry / negative to trusting / positive. No?
I guess you saw this after you made the looking exercise that it is not possible.
If not i will have to again ask "can you please locate where is this "I" choosing something ?

Or is this simply a constant flow, a constant change and movement..?
Constant flow. Constant change and movement. I observe. I observe. I observe.
Sure. Brilliant looking.
But there is no "i" to observe. Being aware is happening..Observing is happening..Eating, drinking happening..
All by itself.
I saw how I don't control anything. Not even thoughts. Awareness is just there, everything is flowing. I can get caught up, and then let it go.

Then all of a sudden a thought will pop out of nowhere, there was a thought about a small step I could take re my business, so after my observation I wrote it down to do later. Nothing more to do.

I don't do anything. All the tension I feel in my body is me trying to do something! Trying so hard to control thought, to control sensation, to make something happen and to make me into something.

There is only awareness, I can't even say that I am the awareness because the awareness is just there. Everything is just flowing.

So relaxing!

Beautiful :)
Wonderful.
No need for words.
That is what really is.

Let's look more to settle things in more..
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:16 pm

https://i5.walmartimages.ca/images/Larg ... 4285_R.jpg

Please take a good LOOK at this apple.

When looking at an apple, there's color; a thought saying ‘apple’; and maybe a thought saying,
"I'm looking at an apple." What is known for sure?
Color is known and thoughts are known.

What about the content of thoughts, what they describe? Actual experience does not refer to thoughts ABOUT something…because that is only just more thought. Actual experience is sound, thought, color, smell, taste, sensation.

Is there really an ‘apple’ here, or only color and a thought ABOUT ‘apple’?

Can ‘apple’ be found in actual experience?
While these thoughts are known, what they talk ABOUT can't be found in actual experience.

This is what is meant by ‘looking in actual experience ‘. What you know for sure, and, is always here.

Taste labelled ‘apple’ is known color labelled ‘apple’ is known sensation labelled ‘apple’ is known (when apple is touched)
Smell labelled ‘apple’ is known
Thought about/of an ‘apple’ is known

However, is an apple actually known?
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Wed Mar 13, 2019 12:19 pm

Another simple experiment to highlight the difference between actual experience and the stories thought tells about experience.
Look at some object(s) in the room.
Hold up "your" hand so the objects are now covered.
Notice that a thought may say there are objects hidden behind the hand.
In actual experience are there objects “hidden behind the hand”?

Let’s say, for example, that the object ‘hidden by the hand’ is the TV remote. So in that moment the colour labelled ‘TV remote’ is not AE, there are only thoughts about a TV remote that are appearing – so ‘TV remote’ it is imaginary/story. When ‘hand’ moves, colour labelled ‘TV remote’ is seen…then the AE of COLOUR labelled ‘TV remote’ is the actual experience and is not imaginary.
Can you see the difference?
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:20 am

Thank you so much, Adil!

I am starting to see the difference.

So the only thing that is direct experience is what we can actually see or feel or hear in the moment.

There is no I because there is nothing that is solid.

There is no “apple” because this is just a definition.

If we don’t have an actual experience, it is not there like the hidden remote.

So during the day, should I be labelling all that is direct experience and letting go of what is not? For example notice thought but don’t get caught up in content, with or notice when I define something and instead go back to what I can actually experience directly?

I notice that there is a lot of unconscious activity that makes me feel fear and contraction. Should I just notice the various sensations and allow them to change on their own time?

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:23 pm

Thank you so much, Adil!

I am starting to see the difference.

So the only thing that is direct experience is what we can actually see or feel or hear in the moment.

There is no I because there is nothing that is solid.

There is no “apple” because this is just a definition.

If we don’t have an actual experience, it is not there like the hidden remote.

Thank you Paula :) Love / Life is doing its thing.
Life is lifing. There is no 2 sides of this conversation.. Much love sent!

Ok Let's look,
yes direct experiences are experienced with 5 senses and thought labels them
thought is also a direct experience as a face value but its content is not.
The content of thought is more thoughts. A thought is empty of content. Thought, in and of itself does not contain any actual experience.

Can you find an actual ‘fish’ in the word/thought/label ‘fish’? Can you find an actual “I” in the word/thought/label “I”?


The thought “I still believe that I am a “me” arises. So the thought is actual experience of thought. And other thoughts that arise with that thought, about that thought, are the content of that thought.

Ok, so let's look now, where thoughts are actualy coming from. A similar exercise like the attention which will make you look deeper..

Take another 10 minutes..

Wait for the next thought and look, where is it coming from and where is it going?

Tell me, do you know what the next thought will be before it arrives?

Can you stop a thought form coming?

Is I thought a special thought? Is it coming from the same place like all other thoughts, or.. ?

Is there a thinker?

Are you thinking thoughts or thoughts pop in by themselves?


Take a good look and write what you find out.


I notice that there is a lot of unconscious activity that makes me feel fear and contraction. Should I just notice the various sensations and allow them to change on their own time?
If there is fear, focus on fear.
Notice, that it's protection mechanism. The fear itself is like a door, it holds you from looking behind the door. But it's just fear. It’s ok for it to be here, it is only doing its job. Just let it be there, acknowledge its presence with respect and gratitude, check where it feels physically in the body. Notice sensation.

What is fear itself?
What is it protecting?
What needs to be protected?
What is that feels threatened?


Ask it to reveal why it’s here, what it is trying to tell you, ask the fear to share its wisdom.
If there is no self, then there is nothing that needs to be protected, right?
Honor the feeling. Bow to it, thank it for doing its job. Notice, it is here to protect, it's a friend. Fer is really love in disguise. It is only showing you where to look, the dark areas.

Now, look behind it.
Is there anything behind the fear?
if so, what? And what is behind that?


Much Love.
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:01 pm

Hi Adil,

I am so incredibly grateful to you and this process. There are so many amazing changes already, more ease in my day and a joy in seeing simple things, just allowing them to be there and taking the time to enjoy them rather than staying caught up in the thoughts around what I should do. So freeing!
Can you find an actual ‘fish’ in the word/thought/label ‘fish’? Can you find an actual “I” in the word/thought/label “I”?
No I can't! Crazy!

10 minute exercise:
Wait for the next thought and look, where is it coming from and where is it going?

Tell me, do you know what the next thought will be before it arrives?

Can you stop a thought form coming?

Is I thought a special thought? Is it coming from the same place like all other thoughts, or.. ?

Is there a thinker?

Are you thinking thoughts or thoughts pop in by themselves?
I have no idea where they come from and where they go! They are like bubbles that just pop in and out of nowhere. Seems to be somewhere in the middle of my body, but not always exactly the same place?

I don’t know what the next thought will be before it arrives. I can’t stop it from coming.

All the thoughts are the same, there are no special thoughts. The I thought seems to be coming from the same place.

There are some thoughts that seem to be associated with a body sensation, like thoughts about what I’m going to do next or fear connected with the tension in my neck and shoulders and contraction in the stomach. But they are separate from the body sensations, although may be related. Feed into one another I think.

There does not seem to be a thinker, just thoughts.

Thoughts just pop in by themselves! There’s nothing I can do to either start or stop them! I can add language though. For example, I can say “start thinking” in my head. But then there will be quiet. And there is the urge before the language, like an urge to say start thinking, and then I say it. So I’m not so much thinking as responding with language to an urge that is already there.

I will do the fear questions in the next post!

User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:29 pm

What is fear itself?
What is it protecting?
What needs to be protected?
What is that feels threatened?
Fear feels like a sensation of wanting to hide, caving inwards in my neck and shoulders and belly. I want to protect myself. I feel threatened.

It is protecting me from the memory of being punished. That someone will punish me, like my mom did. It is afraid of being shamed, unloved, abandoned.

It is protecting me from feeling sadness and loneliness. From the feeling that I am a failure and nobody loves me. But... these are all more thoughts!!!!

It is trying to protect "me"... but there is no me!

What feels threatened is my presence. Just being there and being ok. The feeling of being free and wild and following my heart. It is threatened by people that tell me that this is not ok. Or the memory of that.

That if I follow my heart and what I am meant to do I will die.

It is protecting me from dying.
Ask it to reveal why it’s here, what it is trying to tell you, ask the fear to share its wisdom.
If there is no self, then there is nothing that needs to be protected, right?
Honor the feeling. Bow to it, thank it for doing its job. Notice, it is here to protect, it's a friend. Fer is really love in disguise. It is only showing you where to look, the dark areas.
Fear, why are you here? I am here because your mom is not taking care of you. She is hitting you and yelling at you and that is not ok.

But fear, my mom is not here anymore. That was a long time ago.

Fear: It still wasn't ok. And she still does this. You will see her this afternoon and she will try to put you down again.

So the fear is afraid that my boundaries will be violated, that I will be insulted and put down and silenced.

That is true that I often allow myself to be put down and silenced. But if you hold me down, fear, that is what happens. I can't flow and I can't protect myself.

Can we work together? I will ensure that I have healthy boundaries and I no longer allow for people to put me down or insult me. You can soften and allow the soft parts of me that are so beautiful to flow through. I promise they won't be taken away.
Is there anything behind the fear?
if so, what? And what is behind that?
Behind the fear is more presence, awareness, love. It is so vulnerable, and it has been violated in the past. When I loved my mom she hit me. So fear doesn't want me to love because it is vulnerable.

I think it's going to be a journey. It is less tight now, but fear is still there. It is trying to protect me because the love within feels so fragile.

But maybe it's not fragile at all. Maybe my mom had her own reasons for being angry and it had nothing to do with my love. Maybe my love and presence and the emptiness / fullness that is behind the fear is ok. Maybe it can even embrace the fear.

Fear is changing now. It is more dynamic. There is some flow. It is not all there is. There is also sadness and loneliness and some shame. Emotions, but really they are also sensations, I can feel the pulsating and the tightness and movement.

It is all flowing and it is beautiful, even the fear and the sadness.

The thoughts start again, but is this really it? Is this all I have to do? What about all the plans?

But I see truly that this is all there is. When there is doing to be done doing will do its thing. I just show up and pay attention to what is needed, if there is fear I can pay attention to the fear and ask what it needs. I don't need to be afraid of the fear. So cool.

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:36 am

Thank you Paula,

Very good looking and thanks for sharing "your" story with me :) I really enjoy reading your process..
I see that you are ready to clearly see..just need a little push and you are really ready to realize "what is..
We will be looking all fields to make it more clear for you.

This process has no goal of getting rid of "the story" or emotions, our main goal is to realize that there is no separate self and never existed. Once you see this and understand it with your whole being, the "fog" might dissolve right away, but most of the time, not all of them disappear in an instant. The difference, however, is that with the understanding, for the first time you can deal with that "dust" in an authentic way. As you continue, no much "noise" will bother any more.
Emotions and feelings pop out, then disappear, and then pop out ... That's it.
Only key is LOOKING! Change thinking to LOOKING. That's it.

Let's look:
There are some thoughts that seem to be associated with a body sensation, like thoughts about what I’m going to do next or fear connected with the tension in my neck and shoulders and contraction in the stomach. But they are separate from the body sensations, although may be related. Feed into one another I think.
We will be looking at this on the chapter "body" dear Paula.
But all i can say is for now is "sensation is coming from the thought" is just another thought. The only link between them is another thought saying it. We will be looking ;)
There does not seem to be a thinker, just thoughts.
Seems like / feels like points to uncertainity.
If a "thinker" cannot be actually experienced, it does not exist. Period!
:)

All rest is; you made a brilliant looking...
Thank you
Let's go on..
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
adilerten
Posts: 1399
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:33 pm

Re: Help me become free

Postby adilerten » Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:58 am

So..

As you see thoughts appear and disappear it self without any control or controller.
Let's look deeper to these decision and choices

How are they done ?

Let's make a small exercise,

1. Place both hands on a table in front of you, palms down.
2. When you have done that, rest for a moment and then raise one hand in the air but not the other.

Don't go to thoughts, examine your direct experience. Do this as many times as you like, and each time inquire:-

What is it exactly that is choosing which hand to raise? Why that hand but not the other ?
Can you find a separate individual or anything that is doing the choosing?
What is it that is controlling the hand?
Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?
Can anything be found that makes the hand move?
How is the decision made?


Please write what comes..

Sending much love
Events happen, deeds are done, but there is no individual doer thereof."
Buddha

User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:12 pm

Hi Adil,

Thank you for all your kind and wise guidance :-)

Here are my observations on the exercise:
What is it exactly that is choosing which hand to raise? Why that hand but not the other ?
The first time the decision was unconscious, it just happened.
Other times there would be a thought, arising out of nowhere, that would choose the hand.
Like "that one" - then lift.
Can you find a separate individual or anything that is doing the choosing?
No. The thought comes from nowhere.
What is it that is controlling the hand?
Thought seems to control the hand, but nothing controls the thought, it just arises from nowhere.
Can a ‘controller’ of any description be located?
There is no controller. Once thought arises there is the identification of thought with "me" so it appears that "I" choose, but the thought comes first and it comes out of nowhere. CRAZY!

Also, I can have a thought to lift the hand and not lift the hand, so it's not just the thought that causes it... There seems to be a movement that arises out of nowhere that enables the hand to lift, sometimes with a conscious thought and sometimes without it.
Can anything be found that makes the hand move?
Nothing can be found that makes the hand move.

The more I do it, it feels like a coming together of events that go beyond even my own thought and body that lead to the movement taking place at that moment, in that way. Like my hand is being moved.

It feels peaceful, like I'm just the puppet and I'm being moved :-)
How is the decision made?
There is some connection between a decision to move the hand and some movement that is already taking place. But maybe the decision is not really mine either, because it comes from nowhere.

The decision is made by the movement itself. It starts way before my hand moves, even when you wrote to me and told me to try it, and then I tried it, but before that you learned it, and you tried it.... so it is a movement that has started from beyond time and is just carried out and completed in the moment. Probably leading to other movement...

That is nutty.

User avatar
BeHereNow
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:00 am

Re: Help me become free

Postby BeHereNow » Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:14 pm

Adil,

I really enjoy sharing "my story" with you as well. Thank you for listening.

During my 10 minute observation today, I cried as I saw the ways in which I am so scared and all the stories behind that, but there was almost a peace, a knowing that I am not in charge or to be blamed for these fears and thoughts.

I can allow them to carry themselves out without repressing them. I just have to be patient as I look and observe the movement that is taking place. There is nothing more for me to do than witness with love.

Much metta,
Paula


Return to “ARCHIVES”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest