West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

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Clashnacrona
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West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:48 am

LU is focused guiding for seeing there is no real, inherent 'self' - what do you understand by this?
That the ego creates a false sense of self which is brought about by the conditioning and false beliefs that we take on from our parents or other care givers from about the age of 3. As infants we don't see any separation. This sense of separation by the ego where we take on the beliefs that we are this body/mind is what causes all our suffering.

What are you looking for at LU?
I'm looking for a guide to be honest and straight with their guidance. I'm hoping to be helped in identifying any false beliefs. And above all I really want to be able to drop the sense of 'I' that I have. I'm hoping be able to see through the illusion of the 'self'so I can then just observe my thoughts and emotions and not get caught up and not identify them as being 'me'. This would be real liberation for this body/mind.

What do you expect from a guided conversation?
I expect honest feedback. I hope to be guided with compassion but also with directness when needed. I expect to be challenged and confronted if I stray off track. I also would like to be encouraged when I start to hit the mark or am going in the right direction. I would also like to request Tay as my guide if possible. Eshwar recommeded her to me.

What is your experience in terms of spiritual practices, seeking and inquiry?
I have been meditating using various practices like TM loving kindness mindfulness for the last 15 years on and off. I have strugggled to keep any practice going for more than 3/4 months at a time with long breaks in between. I also tried Kriya yoga for a while and Chi Kung. I have been practising self inquiry with an online group from the USA for the last 18 months. There are 5 participants and we pose questions to each other and do a report once a week. This group is run by a person called Art Ticknor who had his awakening about 15 years ago.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how willing are you to question any currently held beliefs about 'self?
10

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forgetmenot
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby forgetmenot » Tue Feb 12, 2019 11:02 am

Hi AdoB,

I am happy to assist you in exploring the idea of the separate self. At LU we are described as guides - not teachers - as our role is to directly point to what IS, through the use of exercises and questions. Your role is to LOOK carefully to what is being pointed at. It is this simple LOOKING (not thinking) that brings the realisation that there is no separate self and never has been. This is an experiential based guiding and is not a discussion or a debate.

Here are links to information I would like you to read before we begin.

Disclaimer:-

http://liberationunleashed.com/disclaimer-2/

Terms & Conditions:-

https://www.liberationunleashed.com/register/terms/


“Liberation Unleashed is not …” in the FAQ’s of LU.

http://liberationunleashed.com/about/faq/#faq-1041


Please learn to use the quote function. When replying to a question, please use the quote function to highlight the question being answered. Instructions are located in the link below:

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=660

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fAToDNh9hQ&app=desktop

Please confirm that you have read the disclaimer and the other links and we can then begin the exploration.

Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:44 am

Hi Kay,

Thanks so much for agreeing to be my guide. I have read the guidelines and disclaimers and FAQ's and am ready to start. I do feel a bit nervous but that's natural enough I suppose.

Regards

Ado

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forgetmenot
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby forgetmenot » Wed Feb 13, 2019 2:10 am

Hi Ado,

Feeling nervous is normal. You may also experience anxiety, fear, resistance, resentment, anger, as well as joy, happiness and sadness. Just keep me in the loop with what is arising for you.

Thank you for reading the links, including the disclaimer and using the quote function.

Some housekeeping guidelines:-
1. Post at least once a day, or every second day. If you need more time, or are unable to post for several days, just write a quick post on your thread to let me know please.

2. Please answer what's true for you once you have looked to see what is being pointed at, rather than any sort of 'ideal' answer. Ideal answers may sound good but will be of no benefit to you in having you realise that there is no separate self. There is no one judging answers given, so please be100% honest in your answers and inquiry.

3. This exploration is based on actual experience (AE) - smell, taste, sound, sensation, colour and observed thoughts. Long-winded analytical and philosophical answers are best avoided and may even hinder progress. This is not a self-improvement process. There is no ‘self’ to improve.

4. Put aside all other teachings, philosophies, rituals, practices, books/reading and so on for the remainder of this investigation. Really put all your effort and attention in to seeing this reality, as it is. If you have a daily meditation practice, it is fine to continue that but is not necessary for this exploration. Be here with an open and curious mind.

Technology is not perfect and sometimes there is a glitch which can wipe out your responses. It is advisable that you copy and paste questions asked into Word, answer them there and then copy and paste them to your thread. Always save a copy of what you have done in Word - it will save you time in the long run!

To begin with, so that we both become aware of what your expectations are about this exploration ie what life will look and feel like and what you want/hope will change or not change etc in your own words could you please answer the 4 following questions::

How will life change?
How will you change?
What will be different?
What is missing?


Throughout this exploration I would like you to answer all questions that I have written in blue text. Please answer questions individually, remembering to use the quote function to highlight the question being answered.

Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 3:22 pm

Hi Kay,
I'll answer those questions this evening when I get in from work.
Regards
Ado

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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:51 pm

How will life change?
I'm not sure if life will change much at all but maybe how I perceive it might change.

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 7:53 pm

How will you change?
I don't really expect to change much but hopefully I'll be less reactive to my thoughts feelings and emotions.

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:01 pm

What will be different?
Hopefully I'll switch allegiance and identify with my true nature rather than the false “I”. If this happens I really don't know what to expect. I could rattle off plenty of stuff I’ve read or heard talked about in podcasts and interviews with awakened people but that’s their experience and not mine so I’ll wait and see. My expectations are pretty low that this investigation with reveal anything to be totally frank. I've had a couple of tough days in work and I'm feeling extremely tired and low which is probably informing those low expectations.

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:05 pm

What is missing?
A connection to what is real and present . It is there at times when I meditate and take time out to focus on my breath during the day but generally when I’m around people especially in work or with my ex wife and kids I find it very hard to stay with the now and I invariably find myself being pulled out of myself and reacting to situations.

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:16 pm

Hi Kay,

Also just to let you know that I had a run in with a junior manager in work a few days ago. I had a very strong reaction of anger almost verging on rage, internally, which definitely felt like old stuff. I'm pretty sure I went into a child mode and was reacting to something from the past rather than the situation at hand. I did some work on that in a reflection group today that we have as a support in work. I felt quite angry again while recounting the incident in the group and also felt quite sad and teary but I did get some resolution on it but I'm feeling quite ashamed about having those feelings now. I'm not sure if any of this is relevant to this investigation but you mentioned to keep you updated on anything arising so that's why I'm mentioning it here.

Regards

Ado

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forgetmenot
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby forgetmenot » Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:15 am

Hello Ado,

When answering questions….just answer them in the one post and then hit ‘submit’, that way everything is on the one post. If you want to know what a post looks like before submitting it…just click on ‘preview’.

The purpose of the questions was for you and to become aware of any expectations you may have of what having the realisation may look like or feel like. Expectations have a habit of getting in the way of the exploration and even blind siding the fact that the realisation has happened. There is nothing to be done with expectations other than to be aware of them and any others that appear as we move through this exploration. Also be aware that when desired expectations are not met, fear, anger, resistance, resentment, frustration can arise. Let me know if and when this happens so we can look at them together.
How will you change?
I don't really expect to change much but hopefully I'll be less reactive to my thoughts feelings and emotions.
Perception changes and with that some reactions etc may change. The core belief of being a separate self is seen through which also includes others beliefs that support this idea. However, like a rug that is beginning to unravel, there are still many knots (beliefs, patterns) that need undoing. Continuing to LOOK after the realisation is very much the key. LU only guides to the realisation of ‘no separate self’. You will have to find your own means of unravelling other beliefs, emotions and patterns.
What will be different?
Hopefully I'll switch allegiance and identify with my true nature rather than the false “I”. If this happens I really don't know what to expect. I could rattle off plenty of stuff I’ve read or heard talked about in podcasts and interviews with awakened people but that’s their experience and not mine so I’ll wait and see.
Yes….just be here with an open and curious mind with a 100% willingness to look at what is being pointed at. It is the looking that brings the realisation.
My expectations are pretty low that this investigation with reveal anything to be totally frank. I've had a couple of tough days in work and I'm feeling extremely tired and low which is probably informing those low expectations.
The preference is to have no expectations, but this is rarely possible. There is always expectations….as you said, you could rattle off many that you have heard about, read about and even desire yourself because you would like your life to change. Please put aside anything you have heard or read…as it is different for everyone. Realising no self is more of a subtle shift. There will be no singing angels, fireworks etc. It is simply a light bulb moment.
What is missing?
A connection to what is real and present . It is there at times when I meditate and take time out to focus on my breath during the day but generally when I’m around people especially in work or with my ex wife and kids I find it very hard to stay with the now and I invariably find myself being pulled out of myself and reacting to situations.
There is only ever the now. Where else could ‘you’ possibly be?
Also just to let you know that I had a run in with a junior manager in work a few days ago. I had a very strong reaction of anger almost verging on rage, internally, which definitely felt like old stuff. I'm pretty sure I went into a child mode and was reacting to something from the past rather than the situation at hand. I did some work on that in a reflection group today that we have as a support in work. I felt quite angry again while recounting the incident in the group and also felt quite sad and teary but I did get some resolution on it but I'm feeling quite ashamed about having those feelings now. I'm not sure if any of this is relevant to this investigation but you mentioned to keep you updated on anything arising so that's why I'm mentioning it here.
Thank you for sharing. We can look at the idea of ‘anger’, ‘shame’ etc to see what is actually appearing as opposed to what thought said is happening as part of the guiding to see if you can find anyone/anything that is these emotions are actually happening to, but first we learn what LOOKING is and how to LOOK.


I would like you to sit somewhere quiet and become aware of sounds only. Close your eyes and just listen to the sounds for a few minutes. Really hear them.

Tell me ONE sound that you heard when doing this? And make sure that the sound is something you will hear again, for the next phase of this exercise.

Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:07 am

Tell me ONE sound that you heard when doing this? And make sure that the sound is something you will hear again, for the next phase of this exercise.
There were different sounds like traffic windmills from a field up on the hill birds song but the sound that will be there next time is running water from a stream near the house.

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:02 pm

Hi Kay,

I just wanted to let you know that I’m experiencing a lot of fear the last hour or so after a friend of mine who is thinking about registering for a guide himself was saying he wanted to check out LU more closely and make sure it was genuine. I noticed that lots of doubting negative thoughts started to arise like this is all scam and I’ll be made a fool of and the like. I’m also feeling some dread and fear around pulling out of the online self inquiry group I have been invovled in for the last 18 months. I’m afraid of being judged by them when I tell them I’m pulling back for the group while I work with you. I know intellectually these are all just thoughts but I’m still at the stage where I find it hard not to go with them. This may make no sense to anybody else but I think it is good to get it out on “paper” as such anyway. I have had a tendency to jump from one spiritual practice to the next hoping the new one will be the one the brings the awakening.

Thanks

Ado

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Clashnacrona
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby Clashnacrona » Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:04 pm

Hi Kay,

Just a quick update. I saw that the fear I was experiencing was just that only fear and I have e-mailed the self inquiry group and told them I'm working with LU for the foreseeable future and am stepping back from the group for now.

Regards

Ado

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forgetmenot
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Re: West Cork Ireland- asking for Kay

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:50 am

Hey Ado,
Just a quick update. I saw that the fear I was experiencing was just that only fear and I have e-mailed the self inquiry group and told them I'm working with LU for the foreseeable future and am stepping back from the group for now.
Thank you for the sharing and update. Once you are clear about actual experience (AE) and the nature of thought we will explore the idea of fear. To do so though, you need to be clear about AE and thoughts. Throughout this exploration fear will appear…along with resentment, resistance, anger etc. They are normal part of the process of realising no separate self.
Tell me ONE sound that you heard when doing this? And make sure that the sound is something you will hear again, for the next phase of this exercise.
There were different sounds like traffic windmills from a field up on the hill birds song but the sound that will be there next time is running water from a stream near the house.
Great! Actual experience (AE) is simply colour/image, sound, smell, taste, sensation and the face value of thought.

So, I would like you to repeat the exercise and answering from actual experience (AE) only, tell me...

- How is it known that the sound is ‘running water’?
- What is it that says the sound is ‘running water’?
- What is the actual experience of hearing 'running water'?


Remember, you are answering from AE only and not from the intellect. The term ‘actual experience’ (AE) is used to refer to experience ‘right now,’ and noticing the thought stories about them...so ‘looking’ is just plain looking at what is here right now ie image/colour, sound, smell, sensation, taste and the simple knowing of thought at face value

Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/


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