I am determined to see things differently

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forgetmenot
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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Wed Aug 28, 2019 5:15 am

Hello Tricksee,
A thought is known, is it not? Are you not the knower/awarer of thoughts when they appear? Is it possible to have a thought without knowing that you have had a thought? In other words, can a thought happen without the knowing of it? Can a thought sit somewhere, unknown, waiting for it to be noticed?
Yes there is an awareness of thoughts. It is when a fictitious I seems to appear and claim them with labels turning them into something they are not. Including the I itself.
Where exactly is this fictitious “I” that does that? How can an illusion DO anything? A thought appears after claiming doership/ownership…so what? All you have to do is LOOK to see what that thought is pointing to, to see if it has any merit to it. Thoughts are not a problem…they are phenomena that comes and goes like sound, colour, smell, taste, sensation and sound. Can you find anyone/anything that is identifying with any of these ‘things’?

We had a quick look at the idea of doership when we looked to see if we can choose what we are aware of. This is the same exercise and yet a little different. You have seen that there is no controller via the palm flipping exercise. You have seen that there is no choose via the drink exercise and you have seen that there is no chooser of what is being ‘awared’. So let’s bring all that home to see if there is an actual doer/doership.

Take a few relaxed breaths to let the dust settle for a while, and then:
Look on your right.
Then look on your left.
Finally, bring your head back to centre, close your eyes and look in front.

Okay, so when you look on the right, the view on the right is seen (whatever that is).
When you look on the left, the view on the left is seen (whatever that is).
And then, when you look in front of you with eyes closed, the view in front is seen (ie ‘black space’).

So, when the view on the right is seen, do you have the ‘choice’ not to see? I’m not asking can you ‘choose’ to see something else like another view or ‘black space’ if you close your eyes. The question is, can you turn seeing off? Can you NOT see what is seen?

Same thing with the view on the left, can you NOT see the view on the left?

Same thing with the view in front with closed eyes, can you NOT see the ‘black space’?

Can you turn off seeing?

What did the 'chooser' choose? Did a 'self' choose something?

If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?


Love, Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Tricksee
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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Wed Aug 28, 2019 5:59 am

Hi Kay
Where exactly is this fictitious “I” that does that? How can an illusion DO anything? A thought appears after claiming doership/ownership…so what? All you have to do is LOOK to see what that thought is pointing to, to see if it has any merit to it. Thoughts are not a problem…they are phenomena that comes and goes like sound, colour, smell, taste, sensation and sound. Can you find anyone/anything that is identifying with any of these ‘things’?
This is kind of funny because right now I am feeling crappy (sick) tight chest, sore throat… I have a cup of tea in front of me and a cup of coffee (both now cold) from the previous exercise. lol! all these sensations that are there, are simply sensations. If I reach for a drink it is just happening there is "no one" doing anything No sick person,thirsty person… these are just all sensations happening right here, right now.
So, when the view on the right is seen, do you have the ‘choice’ not to see? I’m not asking can you ‘choose’ to see something else like another view or ‘black space’ if you close your eyes. The question is, can you turn seeing off? Can you NOT see what is seen?
There is no choice it is just happening, I cannot turn it off. It is as it is. Just like the sensations in my chest and my throat.
Same thing with the view on the left, can you NOT see the view on the left?
I can see the view on the left there is no choice involved.It is what it is.
Same thing with the view in front with closed eyes, can you NOT see the ‘black space’?
There is no choice. Black it is.
Can you turn off seeing?
No
What did the 'chooser' choose? Did a 'self' choose something?
There is no self to choose anything
If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?
No one does anything lol! This is mind blowing!!!

Thank You Kay

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Wed Aug 28, 2019 11:13 am

Hello Tricksee,
Where exactly is this fictitious “I” that does that? How can an illusion DO anything? A thought appears after claiming doership/ownership…so what? All you have to do is LOOK to see what that thought is pointing to, to see if it has any merit to it. Thoughts are not a problem…they are phenomena that comes and goes like sound, colour, smell, taste, sensation and sound. Can you find anyone/anything that is identifying with any of these ‘things’?
This is kind of funny because right now I am feeling crappy (sick) tight chest, sore throat… I have a cup of tea in front of me and a cup of coffee (both now cold) from the previous exercise. lol! all these sensations that are there, are simply sensations. If I reach for a drink it is just happening there is "no one" doing anything No sick person,thirsty person… these are just all sensations happening right here, right now.
Feeling crappy is crappy…get better soon.

So the idea, thoughts of being and feeling crappy aren’t going to go away, however when you look you can see that actually it isn’t really happening to anyone. Quite clever how this dream works :)

Let’s see if we can find if experience has a location like thought suggests. Thought suggests that the sensation labelled as “tight chest” is located in a particular place. Let’s challenge that assumption :)

If experience has a location, where, exactly, is it located?
Imagine a hammer hitting your thumb, sensation of pain appears, thought saying, "ouch!!"

Where exactly did all of that happen?
Where was experience located?
Was experience of pain located in the thumb?
Was experience of images located at the thumb and hammer?
Or is experience always "closer" than even the word "here" can convey?
Does anything actually have a location?
How would you know?
What would count as evidence of actual location?

If you can't choose what you're aware of, then what else is there to choose?
No one does anything lol! This is mind blowing!!!
There is freedom is seeing there is no chooser. There have never ever been right or wrong choices made by anyone or anything.
This is mind blowing!!!
Yep, that it is…it’s all a clever illusion, a hall of mirrors. :)

Love, Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Thu Aug 29, 2019 8:23 am

Hi Kay

My Sense of time has been turned upside down with this bug I seem to have…
If experience has a location, where, exactly, is it located?
Where exactly did all of that happen?
The sensation would be the actual experience, the thoughts are simply reacting by relating to the experience.
Where was experience located?
nowhere it just was
Was experience of pain located in the thumb?
No (only thoughts about the thumb, labelling...)
Was experience of images located at the thumb and hammer?
No the images just appeared
Or is experience always "closer" than even the word "here" can convey?
Yes (It kind of reminds of looking at both hands and then putting one behind my back even though I cannot see it I may still feel it, it hasn't gone anywhere. It is still part of me even though I cannot see it I know it is there.
Does anything actually have a location?
No Not in a physical sense. There simply is…
How would you know?
By LOOKING at what anything is pointing to…
What would count as evidence of actual location?
Actual Location would be Here and Now. I do not have any other words for this…


Thank You Kay

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Thu Aug 29, 2019 8:59 am

Hello Tricksee,
Does anything actually have a location?
No Not in a physical sense. There simply is…
How would you know?
By LOOKING at what anything is pointing to…
It cannot be known if anything has a location. It is only thoughts that suggests something has a location, or is located somewhere. What something and what somewhere?
What would count as evidence of actual location?
Actual Location would be Here and Now. I do not have any other words for this…
Location is not known, so there is no evidence that would count as evidence of actual location. Can you see this? What is the AE of “location”? It simply points to thought. Can you find “location” in/as colour or sound, or smell or taste or sensation? Or only as an appearing thought?

Maybe revisiting this exercise might be a good idea. You need to implement the exercises given, into your daily life so that it confirms and cements what you are seeing and becoming aware of. It is no good just doing the exercises once, so you can respond to your thread. You need to put the exercises into use throughout your day as you go about your day….ie put the seeing into daily seeing/knowing through constant practice of exercises given.

1. Close the eyes and hold up one hand. Pay attention only to the felt sensation ‘of the hand’.
2. Open the eyes, and now observe the hand by looking only.
3. While looking at the hand, pay attention to the felt sensations.

Repeat 1 to 3 as many times as needed and investigate…

Can you see that both the ‘visual sight’ (colour) and the sensation appear simultaneously but ‘separately’, meaning that none of them is coming from the other or contained by the other?

Do they just appear equally, ‘beside’ each other without any hierarchy or link between them?

Is there any link between the sensation and the sight ie colour? In other words is the sensation actually ‘coming from’ the sight (colour labelled as ‘hand’), or only thought and mental constructs link them?


Love, Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Tricksee
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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:37 pm

Hi Kay
I think I need to really practise what I am trying to say as I do not seem to convey it very accurately (a seemingly Life long Challenge) So I tend to say less and it still can come out differently than intended.
What would count as evidence of actual location?
Actual Location would be Here and Now. I do not have any other words for this…
Location is not known, so there is no evidence that would count as evidence of actual location. Can you see this? What is the AE of “location”? It simply points to thought. Can you find “location” in/as colour or sound, or smell or taste or sensation? Or only as an appearing thought?
In this case what I was trying to convey was that there is no known location which is what the here and now was pointing to if i were to really look. I am not sure if that is any clearer. I cannot find location in colour or sound, smell or taste or sensation. What I am beginning to see is that Thoughts are produced by senses and labelling is produced by thoughts and locations arise out of thoughts. When I believe or get pulled in by my thoughts a location is thought to exist. I do practise daily and have for a long time now and have started to notice differences in the way I see. sometimes I can catch myself in the middle of a situation and see I am caught up in it, sometimes after the situation, and sometimes before I am about to react… So that is what I mean when I say there is only "here and now" there is no location if I LOOK.
Believe it or not to type this out with these words has taken me almost an hour. I do greatly appreciate your patience with me in this.

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Thu Aug 29, 2019 10:37 pm

Hi Kay
Can you see that both the ‘visual sight’ (colour) and the sensation appear simultaneously but ‘separately’, meaning that none of them is coming from the other or contained by the other?
Yes I can see my hand and I feel a tingling I am looking and sensing at the same time and yet neither the image/colour of the hand or the sensation/tingling is coming from or contained by the image/colour (hand).
Do they just appear equally, ‘beside’ each other without any hierarchy or link between them?
Yes both sensation and image appear equally 'beside each other' without any hierarchy or link between them
Is there any link between the sensation and the sight ie colour? In other words is the sensation actually ‘coming from’ the sight (colour labelled as ‘hand’), or only thought and mental constructs link them?
The link between them is coming from thoughts and mental constructs.

I practised looking with this while doing the dishes, preparing supper, pulling weeds, scratching my foot, and trying to catch a spider on a piece of paper and put it outside…and continue to practise as I remember. Sometimes I really get it! and holy sugar! and some times I get caught up with the labelling and identifying with it. But it seems to happening less and less (with the identification with thoughts). Somehow it seems easier with 'objects' than with 'people'. although I have been suddenly aware of certain changes,responses. an example of this is when someone says something in which i would normally become very angry or upset with and I am aware i am not upset and respond to them in a very calm and natural manner. There does not seem to be a reaction but a pause comes first then a response it deems quite natural and yet there is something else there…(I am not the doer or the responder).


Love and gratitude Tricksee

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:00 am

Hi Tricksee,
Location is not known, so there is no evidence that would count as evidence of actual location. Can you see this? What is the AE of “location”? It simply points to thought. Can you find “location” in/as colour or sound, or smell or taste or sensation? Or only as an appearing thought?
In this case what I was trying to convey was that there is no known location which is what the here and now was pointing to if i were to really look. I am not sure if that is any clearer. I cannot find location in colour or sound, smell or taste or sensation.
Lovely, as long as it is clear. Part of my role is to make sure you are clear :)
What I am beginning to see is that Thoughts are produced by senses and labelling is produced by thoughts and locations arise out of thoughts.
How exactly are “thoughts produced by senses”? If thoughts were expressed via the tweeting of birds or an unknown language, how would you know what they meant? What meaning is given to thoughts are only just thoughts about thoughts.

Thoughts don’t produce labels. Thoughts and labels are one and the same thing. It is just that a thought is being defined further into something called a ‘label’. Just like thoughts are labelled into many other categories like: judgemental thoughts, believing thoughts, describing thoughts. They are simply thought. There is no hierarchy of thoughts. One thought is no more important than another.

Go back and do the palm flipping exercise and see if thought is the catalyst for movement. If it isn’t, then what is the importance of thought? Does it actually do anything? Does it actually know anything? Do thoughts have volition? Can thought manipulate other thoughts or think new thoughts?
When I believe or get pulled in by my thoughts a location is thought to exist.
What is the difference between 'believing a thought' and 'not believing a thought'?

Where is this “I” that is getting “pulled in by my thoughts”? There seems to be a movement of going in and out with thoughts…but can you find this “I” that is doing that?

I do practise daily and have for a long time now and have started to notice differences in the way I see. sometimes I can catch myself in the middle of a situation and see I am caught up in it, sometimes after the situation, and sometimes before I am about to react… So that is what I mean when I say there is only "here and now" there is no location if I LOOK.
There is no “I” that is “catching those moments”. That movement is simply happening…so when you LOOK can you find an “I” that is actually doing it?
Believe it or not to type this out with these words has taken me almost an hour. I do greatly appreciate your patience with me in this.
I am not exhibiting patience….my desire is simply for you to see what IS, and it is that desire that seems to be exhibiting patience :) I will keep on pointing until it is clear, even if it sounds like a scratched LP record going round and round on a turntable :)

With love,
Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Fri Aug 30, 2019 10:39 pm

Hi Kay
Go back and do the palm flipping exercise and see if thought is the catalyst for movement. If it isn’t, then what is the importance of thought? Does it actually do anything? Does it actually know anything? Do thoughts have volition? Can thought manipulate other thoughts or think new thoughts?
Thought is not the catalyst for movement. Thought is not important! it does nothing. and knows nothing. Thought has no power to act! Thought cannot manipulate other thoughts or think new thoughts!
What is the difference between 'believing a thought' and 'not believing a thought'?
Nothing is the difference they are both the same. Nothing a thought may come from those thoughts that there is a choice between believing and not believing. But they are both the sameWhere is this “I” that is getting “pulled in by my thoughts”?
Where is this “I” that is getting “pulled in by my thoughts”?
It is just another thought!
quote]There seems to be a movement of going in and out with thoughts…but can you find this “I” that is doing that?
[/quote]

That I is nowhere and no one!
There is no “I” that is “catching those moments”. That movement is simply happening…so when you LOOK can you find an “I” that is actually doing it?
I see it! The I thinks that it is "catching those moments"
Even the I that sees it is a thought! Its all thoughts!!!! There is nothing to see it just is!!!

Thank you Kay With Love and gratitude.

Quick note I will be away later tonight returning Sunday.

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:23 pm

Hello Tricksee,
Quick note I will be away later tonight returning Sunday.
Thanks for letting me know.
Go back and do the palm flipping exercise and see if thought is the catalyst for movement. If it isn’t, then what is the importance of thought? Does it actually do anything? Does it actually know anything? Do thoughts have volition? Can thought manipulate other thoughts or think new thoughts?
Thought is not the catalyst for movement. Thought is not important! it does nothing. and knows nothing. Thought has no power to act! Thought cannot manipulate other thoughts or think new thoughts!
So are thoughts produced by “senses?

If you look at an abstract painting and the letter "A"seems to pop out. Is that an actual experience of something called the letter A, or is it still the abstract painting that seems to be appearing as the letter A? That is exactly what thought is. It is nothing more than an appearance within an abstract painting. So it has no special meaning, form etc. It is simply THIS/experience appearing exactly as it is. It is an appearing thought story that defines what is appearing and calls it "thought'.
What is the difference between 'believing a thought' and 'not believing a thought'?
Nothing is the difference they are both the same. Nothing a thought may come from those thoughts that there is a choice between believing and not believing. But they are both the same
Exactly. There is no difference between them, they are both AE of thought. It's the content of the thought that differs. The believing thought - says "something is believed'. The not believing thought says it is 'not believed'. So both are the same..the story is different.
Where is this “I” that is getting “pulled in by my thoughts”?
It is just another thought!
Yes! :) Looking is a nice simple thing - there is no need to over-complicate it.

Just look now...a thought can be found, but can a thinker of thought be found?
Can an “I” be found in thought itself?

Sound can be found, but can a hearer of sounds be found?
Can an “I” be found in sound itself?

Colour can be found, but can a see-er of colour be found?
Can an “I” be found in colour itself?

Sensation can be found, but can a feeler of sensation be found?
Can an “I” be found in sensation itself?

Smell can be found, but can a smeller of smell be found?
Can an “I” be found in smell itself?

Taste can be found, but can a taster of taste be found?
Can an “I” be found in taste itself?

Experience can be found, but can an experiencer of experience be found?
It's as simple as that. Just look and see what is actually present - and what is only imaginary.

Even the I that sees it is a thought! Its all thoughts!!!! There is nothing to see it just is!!!
Yes...exactly. You (not Tricksee) are aware of all the stories, however, what you are cannot be defined as someone or something. You are the appearance of every 'thing' and yet none of those things!

A thought is known, yes…as is colour, smell, taste, sensation and sound. Where does thought (known) end, and the knowing of it begin? Can you find a dividing line between the knowing of thought and the thought itself? Or is there simply knowingknown – ie no dividing line? In other words, where does thought end and you begin? And the you I am referring to is not the concept called Tricksee.

Maybe this exercise might help with the question above.

Look at the display before you.
When seeing it, is there any division between seeing, see-er, and the seen?
Are these three separate?
If yes, can you find the boundary between the three? Not an imagined, conceptual boundary, but an actual boundary that can be perceived with one or more of the senses?


Love, Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Tricksee
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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:02 pm

Hi Kay.
So are thoughts produced by “senses?
I see it thoughts are not produces by senses. (It was just a thought they they were) Lol!
Just look now...a thought can be found, but can a thinker of thought be found?
Can an “I” be found in thought itself?
No thinker There is an A/E of thoughts happening
Sound can be found, but can a hearer of sounds be found?
Can an “I” be found in sound itself?
No hearer There is an A/E of sound happening
Colour can be found, but can a see-er of colour be found?
Can an “I” be found in colour itself?
No see-er There is an A/E of image happening
Sensation can be found, but can a feeler of sensation be found?
Can an “I” be found in sensation itself?[/quote

No Feeler There is A/E of sensation happening
Smell can be found, but can a smeller of smell be found?
Can an “I” be found in smell itself?
No smeller. There is an A/E of smell happening
Taste can be found, but can a taster of taste be found?
Can an “I” be found in taste itself?
No taster. There is an A/E of taste happening
Experience can be found, but can an experiencer of experience be found?


No Experience or experiencer There is an A/E of thoughts about experience and experiencer. Every thing is as it is.
A thought is known, yes…as is colour, smell, taste, sensation and sound. Where does thought (known) end, and the knowing of it begin? Can you find a dividing line between the knowing of thought and the thought itself? Or is there simply knowingknown – ie no dividing line? In other words, where does thought end and you begin? And the you I am referring to is not the concept called Tricksee.
There is no dividing line. If one seems to appear it is only because of a thought about division, beginning and ending, There is no beginning or ending. Knowingknown is ever present.
Look at the display before you.
When seeing it, is there any division between seeing, see-er, and the seen?
There is No Division
Are these three separate?
No It is very much like the abstract painting you described where a letter A seemed to appear out of it. It is still an abstract painting and the A was nothing more than an appearance within it. (a thought/story appearing) With no special meaning i.e. form. When I looked around the room before me I could see where thought was separating all the objects and making up individual stories about them i.e. Picture on the wall, Pillows on the couch, Chairs around a table. Thought was making each object look separate and yet when I looked at the hole picture it simple was what it is.


Thank you Kay :)

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Mon Sep 02, 2019 12:04 am

Hello Tricksee,

Okay, so let’s have a look at the body.
Sit with eyes closed for about 15 minutes.
Paying attention only to the pure sensations, without relying on thoughts or mental images:

Can it be known how tall the body is?
Does the body have a weight or volume?
In actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?

Is there a boundary between the body and the clothing?
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?

Is there an inside or an outside?
If there is an inside - inside of what exactly?
If there is an outside, the outside of what exactly?

What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?


Look very carefully, especially with the last question. Take your time, don’t rush. You can look several times during the day while doing other things (like washing hands, showering, having a short break from work, walking, etc.) before replying.

Love, Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Mon Sep 02, 2019 7:41 pm

Hi Kay
Okay, so let’s have a look at the body.
Sit with eyes closed for about 15 minutes.
Paying attention only to the pure sensations, without relying on thoughts or mental images:
Can it be known how tall the body is?
There is no knowing, feeling/sensation of height.
Does the body have a weight or volume?
No A/E sensation.
In actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?
With eyes closed,no.
Is there a boundary between the body and the clothing?
No A/E sensation.
Is there a boundary between the body and the chair?
No A/E sensation.
Is there an inside or an outside?
No A/E sensation,sound.
If there is an inside - inside of what exactly?
No inside the A/E was sound (a gurgling stomach and heart beating)
If there is an outside, the outside of what exactly?
No outside the A/E was sensation (pressure of sitting,warmth,softness of clothing).
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
Thought,
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Sensation.

I have something that occurred the other morning while I was asleep. (I will try not to fumble over my words).
Awareness was present but 'i' did not notice this until 'i' heard the sound of a soft gentle snore,and the sensation of breathing (chest moving up and down, in and out) for a moment there was an awareness that 'i' was still asleep and than the thought of i am watching myself sleep came in and i opened my eyes. A feeling of fear crept in.That i was being watched, observed and at the same time a moment of clarity?

Love Tricksee :)

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Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby forgetmenot » Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:35 am

Hello Tricksee,
I have something that occurred the other morning while I was asleep. (I will try not to fumble over my words).
Awareness was present but 'i' did not notice this until 'i' heard the sound of a soft gentle snore,and the sensation of breathing (chest moving up and down, in and out) for a moment there was an awareness that 'i' was still asleep and than the thought of i am watching myself sleep came in and i opened my eyes. A feeling of fear crept in.That i was being watched, observed and at the same time a moment of clarity?
Yeah…that would have been a little trippy! All sorts of experiences come and go within the dream itself. However, you are never not aware…as you just found out :D
In actual experience does the body have a shape or a form?
With eyes closed,no.
So open the eyes and LOOK. Without thought, how is it known that the body has a shape or form?
Without thought, how is known that colour is the body?

If there is an outside, the outside of what exactly?
No outside the A/E was sensation (pressure of sitting,warmth,softness of clothing).
So, is there a ‘me’ here and an ‘out’ there? Can an subject/object split be found?
What does the word/label ‘body’ ACTUALLY refer to?
Thought,
Yes. The label ‘body’ points to AE of thought and not AE of a body.
What is the ACTUAL experience of the body?
Sensation.
The AE of body is thought. Thought points to the sensation and labels it ‘body’. The sensation labelled as ‘body’ is AE of sensation and NOT AE of the body.
Can you see this?


Here is an even deeper investigation of the body. Please follow each step, don't leave out any. Take your time. Don't move to the next step until the previous one is clearly seen. Repeat the exercise several times.

Stand in front of a bigger mirror.

(1) First, close the eyes and feel the sensations labelled ‘body’.

(2) Then open the eyes and look into the mirror while still paying attention to the sensations.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations and the image in the mirror?
Or just thoughts (and/or mental images) suggest that there is?


(3) While still paying attention to the sensations move one hand and observe the movement from the mirror.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and image of movement in the mirror?

(4) Now do the same movement with the hand, but this time look at the hand directly, not from the mirror.

Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and the image ‘of movement’?
Or only thoughts suggest it?


(5) Now, pay attention only to the image in the mirror.

Does the image by itself suggest in any way that is ‘you’ or ‘your body’?
Does the image itself suggest in any way that it is a ‘body’ at all?
Or are there only colours and shapes?


(6) Where the mirror ends, some parts of the body (probably legs) cannot be seen.

Just by the image in the mirror, is there any ‘knowledge’ that there must be legs, or only thoughts and mental images suggest so?

(7) Now turn away from the mirror and look forward (don’t look directly to any body parts).

Is there a ‘body’ anywhere when all thoughts and images are ignored, or are there only sensations?

(8) Start to walk slowly.

Is there a ‘body walking’, or are there only sensations?
Is there actual experience of ‘walking’ at all?
Or just THOUGHTS ABOUT ‘walking’?
Can such a thing as ‘body’ be found OR just THOUGHTS ABOUT a ‘body’?
Can such a thing as ‘walking’ be found?


(9) Are the sensations localized in space, like ‘going through the room’; OR is there only an image that is labelled ‘room’ and appearing sensations without any location?

Love, Kay
Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
https://freedomalreadyis.com/

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Tricksee
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Aug 07, 2019 6:48 pm

Re: I am determined to see things differently

Postby Tricksee » Tue Sep 03, 2019 2:56 am

Hi Kay

I am responding rater quickly I know but I am fortunate enough to have had the whole day and evening to myself. (work tomorrow) So I actually did practise the exercise all day (with eyes open and in the mirror).
So open the eyes and LOOK. Without thought, how is it known that the body has a shape or form?
Without thought, how is known that colour is the body?[/quote

Without thought the body is not known. (The example of the abstract picture kept coming to mind) as I was Looking at shape/form/colour. the 'body' is part of the abstract picture not separate from it
So, is there a ‘me’ here and an ‘out’ there? Can an subject/object split be found?
Subject/object, 'me' here and out there are only thoughts.
The AE of body is thought. Thought points to the sensation and labels it ‘body’. The sensation labelled as ‘body’ is AE of sensation and NOT AE of the body.
Can you see this?
Yes I do see it now. :)
Is there any connection between the felt sensations and the image in the mirror?
Or just thoughts (and/or mental images) suggest that there is?
There is no connection between the felt sensations and the image in the mirror only thoughts and mental images suggest there is.
Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and image of movement in the mirror?
There is no connection between the felt sensations (labelled 'hand) and image of movement in the mirror.
Is there any connection between the felt sensations (labelled ‘hand’) and the image ‘of movement’?
Or only thoughts suggest it?
Only thoughts suggest it.
Does the image by itself suggest in any way that is ‘you’ or ‘your body’?
The image itself suggests nothing only thoughts about 'body' and 'me' appear.
Does the image itself suggest in any way that it is a ‘body’ at all?
Or are there only colours and shapes?
There are only colour and shapes.
Is there a ‘body’ anywhere when all thoughts and images are ignored, or are there only sensations?
There are only sensations
Is there a ‘body walking’, or are there only sensations?
Only thoughts suggest felt sensations (legs/feet) and the image of movement.
Is there actual experience of ‘walking’ at all?
Or just THOUGHTS ABOUT ‘walking’?
Just Thoughts about walking
Can such a thing as ‘body’ be found OR just THOUGHTS ABOUT a ‘body’?
Just thoughts about a body.
Can such a thing as ‘walking’ be found?
Just thoughts about walking
Are the sensations localized in space, like ‘going through the room’; OR is there only an image that is labelled ‘room’ and appearing sensations without any location?
Sensations are not localized, only labelled images compartmentalize them.

Love, Tricksee.


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