Looking For Guidance

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:43 am

WHAT entity is suffering, exactly?
Can it be pointed to anywhere?
Does it have tangible form or location?
What and where is it?
When I read that question I caught a tiny glimpse that there’s no entity suffering. Suffering is just sensations labelled “suffering”. But it was gone in an instant. Then I started having thoughts about this question.

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Wed Sep 26, 2018 3:24 am

By the way, did you see my earlier message about thoughts?

Today, I talked to someone and as a reaction to something they said, a whirlwind of thoughts started and I got sucked into stories. So many stories. It went on for hours. There was crying and heart ache. Then after the worst passed, I remember to ask, “who’s suffering? Who do these thoughts belong to?”

The immediate answer was “me!”

But I kept asking and questioning and soon a space opened around those thoughts and emotions. There was a “stepping back” motion from the “I” and the stories.

At the moment I see that the stories aren’t necessarily true and don’t have to trap and enslave me.

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gondwana
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Tue Oct 02, 2018 1:48 pm

Sorry for the late reply, it’s been really busy here!
When I read that question I caught a tiny glimpse that there’s no entity suffering. Suffering is just sensations labelled “suffering”. But it was gone in an instant. Then I started having thoughts about this question.
That’s perfect :)

Now that it has been seen once, it can be seen again!

Keep looking for WHAT entity is experiencing suffering/frustration/etc, every time something comes up! That becomes the practice from now ;)
Today, I talked to someone and as a reaction to something they said, a whirlwind of thoughts started and I got sucked into stories. So many stories. It went on for hours. There was crying and heart ache. Then after the worst passed, I remember to ask, “who’s suffering? Who do these thoughts belong to?”

The immediate answer was “me!”

But I kept asking and questioning and soon a space opened around those thoughts and emotions. There was a “stepping back” motion from the “I” and the stories.
Yes. Because deep down it is already known, that there IS no “me” to be suffering.

If there is no entity to be suffering, the suffering is also just a story.

Both the suffering, and the “me”/“I” are just stories!

Keep looking!
At the moment I see that the stories aren’t necessarily true and don’t have to trap and enslave me.
Perfect!
Seen in the moment of looking, freed in the moment of seeing.

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Wed Oct 03, 2018 3:03 am

Keep looking for WHAT entity is experiencing suffering/frustration/etc, every time something comes up! That becomes the practice from now ;)
Alright! :)

I wanted to share a story about meditation.

A few years ago a curious thing occurred in my meditation practice. My hands that were in my lap relaxed so much that I couldn’t feel them anymore. It was unpleasant, like I was losing control of my body, like I was melting away or something.

Years passed and I got used to it and slowly started liking it. I practice muscle relaxation in the whole body and I no longer feel discomfort when it happens. Nowadays relaxation feels like bliss.

I feel like the letting go of control has helped with the identification with the body. Bit by bit tension and control are being let go and with that it feels like the “I” is melting as well, becoming less “noisy” or “intrusive”.

It’s still quite noisy and intrusive inside the mind though. :)

I have heard that the illusion of the “I” might be easier to see through if the “I” is quite relaxed, and doesn’t react violently every time you try to look.

Do you have any thoughts about this?

Another insight I got a while ago was about Shakespeare. I think it was he who said that all the world is a stage and we are actors.

So the other day I actually saw this for a fact! I’ve seen it before and every time it’s so baffling and funny. Like, the whole life and the roles we play is just a play! We’re playing pretend. This is so liberating! Things are just happening in this pretend play. It’s so hard to speak about. Do you know what I mean though?

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gondwana
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Fri Oct 05, 2018 6:14 am

like I was melting away or something.
Nowadays relaxation feels like bliss.
it feels like the “I” is melting as well, becoming less “noisy” or “intrusive”.
That's really cool :). This is certainly one way to see through the "I" illusion. Though it often takes longer this way, it is not the most direct route.
Another insight I got a while ago was about Shakespeare. I think it was he who said that all the world is a stage and we are actors.

So the other day I actually saw this for a fact! I’ve seen it before and every time it’s so baffling and funny. Like, the whole life and the roles we play is just a play! We’re playing pretend. This is so liberating! Things are just happening in this pretend play. It’s so hard to speak about. Do you know what I mean though?
+
I have heard that the illusion of the “I” might be easier to see through if the “I” is quite relaxed, and doesn’t react violently every time you try to look.

Do you have any thoughts about this?
I put the above two quotes side by side as I think you've just answered your own question.

Absolutely! Things are just happening in this pretend play. Can it be seen that "I" or "Vera" is also just a character being played?
Looking closely, can it be seen that this character IS NOT EVEN exactly the same in each scene?! How hilarious! It's not even a single character! It changes from scene to scene, in different social situations for example, like a different "mask" is being put on each time. See it?

And so to your question, we are NOT looking to attack the "I"!
We are NOT looking to kill it!
We are NOT looking to erase it!
We are NOT looking to destroy it!
In fact, we can't anyway.
Simply, ALL that we are looking to do, is simply see the basic truth that it is just a character we pretend to play sometimes, and not a real entity with its own life. It's just a story. Just a made-up character.
That isn't really violent or threatening to the "I" at all, is it?
We can let it play the character, just know that it's only a play.

How does this feel now, from that new perspective?
Seen in the moment of looking, freed in the moment of seeing.

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:13 am

Can it be seen that "I" or "Vera" is also just a character being played?
I can't see it at the moment, but I have seen it in the past.
Looking closely, can it be seen that this character IS NOT EVEN exactly the same in each scene?!
Yes, I have noticed this. Especially with emotions, because they come and they go. It is seen clearly in arguments, for example. One moment Vera is really angry and saying stuff out of hurt, and then she calms down and automatically the things that she said before cease to be true.

Not sure about different social situations.
That isn't really violent or threatening to the "I" at all, is it?
You're right, it's not. The character can play itself. It is not going to be harmed. Quite the opposite, actually. It will be free to play however it plays.
How does this feel now, from that new perspective?
Exciting. But this "play" realization comes and goes. And it doesn't come that often. Last time (before that time) it happened was maybe a month ago. I was walking outside and saw a woman brushing a horse. For some reason I found this hilarious! This human being had tools with which it was keeping this other animal tidy and neat. I don't know but I kept giggling.

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gondwana
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Thu Oct 11, 2018 2:39 pm

Yes, I have noticed this. Especially with emotions, because they come and they go. It is seen clearly in arguments, for example. One moment Vera is really angry and saying stuff out of hurt, and then she calms down and automatically the things that she said before cease to be true.

Not sure about different social situations.
Well. Is "Vera with her mom & dad" the same character as "Vera at work"?
How much do they have in common? As a percentage..
You're right, it's not. The character can play itself. It is not going to be harmed. Quite the opposite, actually. It will be free to play however it plays.
BINGO! That is the key. Total freedom for "you" AND the character - everyone is happy.
Sound nice?
Exciting. But this "play" realization comes and goes. And it doesn't come that often. Last time (before that time) it happened was maybe a month ago. I was walking outside and saw a woman brushing a horse. For some reason I found this hilarious! This human being had tools with which it was keeping this other animal tidy and neat. I don't know but I kept giggling.
That is funny!

Try this, in every situation for the next 24 hours, watch what goes on for the character "Vera".
How does she behave in each situation that arises?
Is there a real "I"/"me" entity there, or just a character acting out various stories?
Seen in the moment of looking, freed in the moment of seeing.

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:39 am

Well. Is "Vera with her mom & dad" the same character as "Vera at work"?
How much do they have in common? As a percentage..
Well, you couldn't have picked two more different situations. These two have almost nothing in common. I'd say the percentage would be about 10-20%.
Try this, in every situation for the next 24 hours, watch what goes on for the character "Vera".
How does she behave in each situation that arises?
Is there a real "I"/"me" entity there, or just a character acting out various stories?
It was hard to remember but I did remember to watch what goes on quite often. But I didn't get the "character awareness" that I was talking about before. I just made observations like "she's typing", "she's thinking what to write", "she has a concern about what others will think about her behavior", "she's feeling upset and off she goes into a spiral of thought".

For example right now, I can sort of observe the character, but at the same time I feel like there's an "I" doing the observing, so...I don't know.

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gondwana
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Tue Oct 16, 2018 1:07 pm

Well, you couldn't have picked two more different situations. These two have almost nothing in common. I'd say the percentage would be about 10-20%.
Exactly! So all that matters here, is that it is clear there CANNOT possibly be a "you", because this character is not even the same from moment to moment! There is no fixed "person" there at all. Just a series of characters (or masks; or stories) playing out, automatically.
It was hard to remember but I did remember to watch what goes on quite often. But I didn't get the "character awareness" that I was talking about before. I just made observations like "she's typing", "she's thinking what to write", "she has a concern about what others will think about her behavior", "she's feeling upset and off she goes into a spiral of thought".
That's great. So we can look at this a slightly different way.

Isn't there just typing happening?
Just thinking happening?
Just concerned thoughts happening?
Just upset feelings & thoughts happening?
Just a spiral of thought happening?
Is any "she"/"me"/"I" required for any of these things to happen?

Try watching again for a day, and see if they happen all by themselves, without any doer.
For example right now, I can sort of observe the character, but at the same time I feel like there's an "I" doing the observing, so...I don't know.
Is there an actual person "I" to be doing the observing? Where is it?
Or is there just observing happening but viewed from a certain perspective?
Seen in the moment of looking, freed in the moment of seeing.

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:09 am

Hi, Tim

I have been given another family crisis situation. This time a family member is very sick and there's not much time left. So I've been and might be a bit absent because of that. This is really unusual. My family is very small and these kinds of events usually happen once every ten years maybe. And now there have been two in a year.

I am able to see this happening to the character. I look at it as if from the outside and find it interesting how life happens in these strange ways. There's a lot of different emotion as well and I watch that too. Or whoever's doing the watching, I don't know.
So all that matters here, is that it is clear there CANNOT possibly be a "you", because this character is not even the same from moment to moment! There is no fixed "person" there at all. Just a series of characters (or masks; or stories) playing out, automatically.
Yes. But I still keep wondering if there might be after all something that doesn't change? But what would that be? I cannot see anything like that.
Isn't there just typing happening?
Just thinking happening?
Just concerned thoughts happening?
Just upset feelings & thoughts happening?
Just a spiral of thought happening?
Is any "she"/"me"/"I" required for any of these things to happen?

Try watching again for a day, and see if they happen all by themselves, without any doer.
Is there an actual person "I" to be doing the observing? Where is it?
Or is there just observing happening but viewed from a certain perspective?
Well. It starts to seem that these things are all just happening without a doer. It's almost like the "I" is the thing that is being done, not the doer itself. Does that make sense? Life is creating the "I"?

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gondwana
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:17 am

I still keep wondering if there might be after all something that doesn't change? But what would that be? I cannot see anything like that.
If you cannot find it, does it exist?
Or is something that is believed-in but can NOT be found, in actual fact simply imaginary?
Well. It starts to seem that these things are all just happening without a doer. It's almost like the "I" is the thing that is being done, not the doer itself. Does that make sense? Life is creating the "I"?
Bingo! You saw it :)

The "I" is BEING DONE. There is no doer. Life, or "the mind", simply creates this sense of self which we call "I", it is merely an illusion. A mirage.

Whether we take away the mirage, or leave it be, does it change the actual reality of whether or not there is water in the desert, in any way AT ALL?
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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Sat Oct 27, 2018 5:40 am

If you cannot find it, does it exist?
Or is something that is believed-in but can NOT be found, in actual fact simply imaginary?
Very confused. People tell you to believe all kinds of things without experiencing them, such as that Earth is round, and atoms. I suppose those things could be experienced with right technology or method, but what about the self? I mean, everyone says it’s there. How can they all be wrong? This is confusing.
Bingo! You saw it :)
There was no fireworks, no big aha moment. It’s like I’ve always known it on some level. I mean I guess if it was always an illusion, there was always knowing on some level, underneath the illusion.

I’m not sure if I saw it. Simply because it wasn’t life transforming. Maybe I haven’t seen it yet? What do you think?

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gondwana
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Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:38 am

Sorry for the delayed reply.
Very confused. People tell you to believe all kinds of things without experiencing them, such as that Earth is round, and atoms. I suppose those things could be experienced with right technology or method
If you were looking into the reality/nonreality of those things, you WOULD also have to look for yourself. But we are not concerned with those thing here.
but what about the self? I mean, everyone says it’s there. How can they all be wrong? This is confusing.
Everyone used to say the earth was flat.
Everyone used to say there were sea monsters waiting at the edges.
Everyone used to say the planets revolved around the earth.
Everyone says that excessive consumerism to the point of destroying our ONLY home planet is a great idea.
A huge number of people said Donald Trump would make a great president.

Need I continue???

People say ALL KINDS of stupid things. Most often associated with selfish beliefs, which they have never looked up the facts on, LET ALONE tested for themselves.
There was no fireworks, no big aha moment. It’s like I’ve always known it on some level.
This is exactly normal. This is why it is often called “the great cosmic joke”!!

It can be so simple, so obvious that many people even glimpse yet still overlook it.

It is only with time, and focus on the new realisation, that it unfolds into something life changing.

The initial realisation can seem unremarkable at first.
I mean I guess if it was always an illusion, there was always knowing on some level, underneath the illusion.
Exactly! How many things do we like to lie to ourselves about, daily?
I’m not sure if I saw it. Simply because it wasn’t life transforming. Maybe I haven’t seen it yet? What do you think?
I think you had an expectation of some huge spiritual revelation. The reality you got did not match your expectation. This is the most common response in the world.

But when has ANY experience ever been exactly as you imagined?

That happens because thought can NEVER accurately represent a real experience. It is always wrong in some way, often major ways. This was pointed out with the very first experiment we ever did with imagining eating a fruit and then actually eating the fruit ;)

Holding onto expectations, is what prevents true seeing.
I mentioned surrender a few times before. Well nursing expectations is the opposite of surrender. It is the self claiming it “knows” the answer, yet again, trying to stay in control! Slippery, huh!

So I ask you, is it possible that you had expectations of what it would be like? Perhaps you even WISH it were more how you expected?


What has happened since your last message. Any changes or new realisations that have arisen?
Seen in the moment of looking, freed in the moment of seeing.

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PepperAlmond
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Re: Looking For Guidance

Postby PepperAlmond » Sun Nov 11, 2018 12:37 am

Sorry for the delayed reply.
That's OK!
It is only with time, and focus on the new realisation, that it unfolds into something life changing.
I see. This makes sense now.
So I ask you, is it possible that you had expectations of what it would be like? Perhaps you even WISH it were more how you expected?
Yes and yes. I did have expectations, based on what I had experienced before. And I thought and wished it would have been something more profound, more life changing. But now I understand that it needs time to develop into something deeper.
What has happened since your last message. Any changes or new realisations that have arisen?
I feel a bit depressed, and I'm still having a hard time to believe that I saw it. The mind keeps saying, "Come on, that can't be it! Where's by huge deep awakening?" :)

So I'm still not sure.

After my last message something did happen. When you said, "You saw it", my mind went into resistance. "No I didn't. This can't be it. Where's my deep life transforming experience?" Et cetera. Disappointment.

So what happened then was that I kind of lost interest in looking and enlightenment and even spirituality and went super secular (if that's the right word). It was pretty interesting. I used to be so spiritually minded and now I went like, "Ah, screw that! I just want to live my life." And what followed was me being present with the day to day activities.

It was kind of as though I saw that there was no answer to my suffering in spirituality, so I abandoned it and turned to my mundane life.

And what resulted is that life has become significantly better and easier. I used to run away from life so much, thinking that I can avoid it if I only became spiritual enough. You know? But then I turned 180 degrees and headed right towards the stuff that I wanted to avoid: the boring, the mundane, the ugly, the messy. And what I have now is much more precious and alive than what was there before. What also happened is that I became more authentic. I relaxed and let go of some shame.

The initial blow was hard, but then I gathered momentum. I guess I let go of a lot of my previous resistance to life. But how and why? What really happened? I'm not consciously aware of what's going on or how LU plays into all of this.

Do you have any ideas?

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gondwana
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Looking For Guidance

Postby gondwana » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:24 am

The initial blow was hard, but then I gathered momentum. I guess I let go of a lot of my previous resistance to life. But how and why? What really happened?
Can it be seen how resistance to life, comes from ideas about WHAT SHOULD BE.
Can it be seen that these WHAT SHOULD BE ideas are just thoughts?
All resistance to life comes from thought claiming what should be, which then does not match what IS.
Does thought know what should be?
How can it possibly know?
We already saw thought is random and uncontrolled.

Once these beliefs begin to drop, what is left, is simply WHAT IS - naked and unobstructed, as it is.
With no belief obstructing, there is simply flow - WHAT IS happens effortlessly, and is always ok just as it is.

Still think no progress has been made?
When you said, "You saw it", my mind went into resistance. "No I didn't. This can't be it. Where's my deep life transforming experience?" Et cetera. Disappointment.
Is this all just more thought?


Seen in the moment of looking, freed in the moment of seeing.


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