Need guidance

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Mon Dec 24, 2012 11:08 am

I feel less obligated to many things that come up
Can you expand on this Raj.

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Eloratea
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Re: Need guidance

Postby Eloratea » Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:54 pm

Hi Elora,
I would say No! However there are moments in the experience where the "I" comes in to play and we get caught up momentarily in this identification and believe it is personal. YES! Thoughts makes us think so.
Hope this answers your question
Yes, thought. But Raj, is there anyone to be caught into identification or beliefs?
I can't find anyone. :)
Can you have a deeper look and say again what's going on there.

Much Love.

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jazztogo
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Re: Need guidance

Postby jazztogo » Wed Dec 26, 2012 7:14 pm

I feel less obligated to many things that come up
Can you expand on this Raj.
Hello Vince,
Happy holidays.
What I meant here was in a very general sense. There are instances where you feel obliged to respond to people and incidents around you, and it suddenly dawns on you that that purpose is not valid anymore since there is no "I". Specially when it concerns myself as the subject. Hope this helps.

All the best

Raj

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Hi Elora,
I would say No! However there are moments in the experience where the "I" comes in to play and we get caught up momentarily in this identification and believe it is personal. YES! Thoughts makes us think so.
Hope this answers your question
Yes, thought. But Raj, is there anyone to be caught into identification or beliefs?
I can't find anyone. :)
Can you have a deeper look and say again what's going on there.

Much Love.
Hello Elora, Trust you are enjoying your holidays.

Looking deeper I certainly cannot see anyone there as the thinker or identifier other that the thought of it. So, it is a mental projection of "I". It takes over and "Self"-ishly claims ownership of every thought word or deed.Does take a lot of effort at the moment to no get caught in it's web. It will eventually get there.


All the best for the season

Raj

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Wed Dec 26, 2012 8:24 pm

Oh Raj, you are a man of few words.
and it suddenly dawns on you that that purpose is not valid anymore since there is no "I"
Do you mean that when they are referring to Raj, that there is nothing to defend any more ?, or no need to be right ? or something else ?

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Wed Dec 26, 2012 8:34 pm

Raj, as a musician, how about composing a short song that encompasses this new perspective ?
i like Haiku as it forces description into few words. (17 sylables 3 lines -5,7,5)
There is a person,
He is a musician by trade,
Sings song of few words.

love

vince

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jazztogo
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Re: Need guidance

Postby jazztogo » Mon Dec 31, 2012 1:44 am

Raj, as a musician, how about composing a short song that encompasses this new perspective ?
i like Haiku as it forces description into few words. (17 sylables 3 lines -5,7,5)
There is a person,
He is a musician by trade,
Sings song of few words.

love

vince
Hello Vince,
My Oh My! This is hard even though I am a musician.
First, I am not poetically inclined. Frankly was not even sure what Haiku really meant even though I have heard about it. I do now thanks to you.
Since my forte in music is jazz it deals more with the improvisation of a tune/melody etc:
I am more at home with simple, good ole words.
Sorry to disappoint you Vince.

All the best for the new year.

Raj

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Mon Dec 31, 2012 2:31 am

Nobody said you have to be good at it. Just have a go...
The end result isn't the purpose. It's the process that reveals.

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Eloratea
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Re: Need guidance

Postby Eloratea » Mon Dec 31, 2012 12:30 pm

Looking deeper I certainly cannot see anyone there as the thinker or identifier other that the thought of it. So, it is a mental projection of "I". It takes over and "Self"-ishly claims ownership of every thought word or deed.Does take a lot of effort at the moment to no get caught in it's web. It will eventually get there.
Hi Raj,
how it is going with „I“ projection?
What kind of effort do you speak of ? Can you have a deeper look and explain it here.
It sounds like mind splits itself and fights itself, which we don't really need. Just patient observation without much thought involvement and effort.
There is already no separate self outside of actual experience.

Happy New Year! :)

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jazztogo
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Re: Need guidance

Postby jazztogo » Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:23 pm

Raj, as a musician, how about composing a short song that encompasses this new perspective ?
i like Haiku as it forces description into few words. (17 sylables 3 lines -5,7,5)
There is a person,
He is a musician by trade,
Sings song of few words.

love

vince
Hello Vince,
My Oh My! This is hard even though I am a musician.
First, I am not poetically inclined. Frankly was not even sure what Haiku really meant even though I have heard about it. I do now thanks to you.
Since my forte in music is jazz it deals more with the improvisation of a tune/melody etc:
I am more at home with simple, good ole words.
Sorry to disappoint you Vince.

All the best for the new year.

Raj
Hello Vince,
Okay! I get the point. Sorry for the long silence. Let me have a go.

First there was a " Me"
And it took so long to see
I was a no-"body"

All the best

Raj


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Hi Elora,
Happy new year to you too. Hope you have a great year.
Looking deeper I certainly cannot see anyone there as the thinker or identifier other that the thought of it. So, it is a mental projection of "I". It takes over and "Self"-ishly claims ownership of every thought word or deed.Does take a lot of effort at the moment to no get caught in it's web. It will eventually get there.
Hi Raj,
how it is going with „I“ projection? Slow in realization as I have been caught up too much in the flow of life. There are great moments when I fully get into the present and enjoy the reality of nothingness.
What kind of effort do you speak of ? Can you have a deeper look and explain it here. The effort is mental trying to get away from the long past conditioning
It sounds like mind splits itself and fights itself, which we don't really need. Just patient observation without much thought involvement and effort.
There is already no separate self outside of actual experience.
Yes! Thanks for the input.

Happy New Year! :)

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Sat Jan 05, 2013 8:01 pm

First there was a " Me"
And it took so long to see
I was a no-"body"
Ha, good one Raj.
Technically there is one too many syllable in the last line. Perhaps more accurately (and with one less syllable) you might have said "I was a no-one".
But, of course the end result is only a reminder to you of what occurred as you considered words to express something else. What was your experiencing as you did it ?

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Eloratea
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Re: Need guidance

Postby Eloratea » Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:24 pm

The effort is mental trying to get away from the long past conditioning
Hi Raj,
What do you have to do with conditioning? What is conditioning? Are you conditioned?

With best wishes!

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jazztogo
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Re: Need guidance

Postby jazztogo » Tue Jan 08, 2013 3:47 pm

First there was a " Me"
And it took so long to see
I was a no-"body"
Ha, good one Raj.
Technically there is one too many syllable in the last line. Perhaps more accurately (and with one less syllable) you might have said "I was a no-one".
But, of course the end result is only a reminder to you of what occurred as you considered words to express something else. What was your experiencing as you did it ?
Hello Vince,
Thank you.
Actually it was a pun on the word " Nobody" which I split on purpose to emphasize "Body".
Truthfully, I did not experience much other than a feeling of relief that I finished it.
Ciao

Raj

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The effort is mental trying to get away from the long past conditioning
Hi Raj,
What do you have to do with conditioning? What is conditioning? Are you conditioned?

With best wishes!
Hello Elora,
In truth I have nothing at all to do with conditioning. In this context, I meant the personal conditioning of my "self" awareness-Ego from day one. I am not conditioned. Only my thought of it.
I do try hard to sit quietly and take in the "now", "is" but in my day to day work etc: the ego just takes precedence. I must admit that I have not tried hard enough.

Ciao

Raj

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:37 pm

I did not experience much other than a feeling of relief that I finished it.
i was more interested in what was occuring during the process, rather than when you finished it.

love vince

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jazztogo
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Re: Need guidance

Postby jazztogo » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:36 pm

I did not experience much other than a feeling of relief that I finished it.
i was more interested in what was occuring during the process, rather than when you finished it.

love vince
Hello Vince,
Sorry. I cannot really put my finger on what occurred while composing that but looking back I surely did have a flash of creative impulse/ intuition of a sort.
Hope this helps.

Raj

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vinceschubert
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Re: Need guidance

Postby vinceschubert » Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:18 am

Raj, i get the feeling that your heart isn't in this ? ?


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