The living question

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The living question

Postby ozpicious » Fri Feb 14, 2014 9:35 pm

First, as requested I am happy to introduce myself.

My name is Ori, and I am happy to join this forum, and glad to see so much activity around the very topic I have been invested in for the last 15 years. This is wonderful, and i'm very grateful for those who took the time to bring all of us together.

My personal realization happened on October 18 2011
This was after years of following various teachers, and also traveling to india and china and constantly investigating various modalities, such as gurdjieff, kabbalah, advita, buddhism, taoism, and the sorts.

From all teachers the closest to my heart was and still is my teacher Gangaji. Ultimately she was the one who guided my through this process the best. The realization itself came of course when I least expected it. Returning from idea, I felt my search was exhausted, and decided to finally put it to rest. Then one evening, the question "Who Am I?" simply arouse again, and was answered in such a simple manner which was something I could have never come to expect.

Later I wrote a recollection of what happened on my blog
and if interested you can visit it here - ... -am-i.html

Since 2011 I have been keeping an active blog - and pouring onto it all understandings and insights the come my way.

Funny thing is that when I looked at Liberation Unleashed on facebook, I felt a sense of familiarity with things I have written myself. Things like these ... encer.html ... ening.html ... story.html

I enjoy feeling the same kind of tone, and feel a kinship at that.

I join this group with enthusiasm and a desire to contribute but also to refine and to question.

I am thinking that there is a lot of excitement here about realizing the nature of 'I' and revealing it for what it is and not what it seems to be. However, this I feel is only the beginning. What 'is not' must be addressed, but 'what is' must also be addressed, and the two in my experience don't necessarily come together.

Also I am eager to investigate this method of direct pointing, but also know that skillful means of developing empathy are also needed whether 'I' is perceived to exists of whether it is not.

I look forward to see this forum engaged in continuous development of ways to engage, understand and explain.

One thing I love about realization is that it made it clear to me, that more then anything else life is an open ended question. And that question will forever continue to live. All our declaration of 'I' attempt to do is put an end to this process of living wonder. Try to stop that which cannot be stopped, and you end up which friction that explains the source of our suffering.

More then anything else I find 'I' as an unfounded declaration of certainty. At the same time "there is no I", it too can potentially carry the energy of a declaration and of certainty. If we do that, we will find ourselves the same place we started in.

That's why I like inquiry and potential of direct pointing. It presents a living question and with it the unfounded certainty is able to dissolve. That's beautiful.

-- ozpicious

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Re: The living question

Postby Ilona » Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:10 pm

Hi ozpicious.
Welcome to the forum! Sorry it took a while to respond.

You said on your blog, that the answer to what I am question is life. I am life. It's great to see that. But here, on this forum we look at all identification. Including I am life.

Can you describe here, on forum (so readers don't need to follow a link to your blog) what happened, what changed, what hasn't changed, and what's next, as you see it now?

What comes up for you, if you hear- there is no I?

Kind regards

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Re: The living question

Postby ozpicious » Thu Feb 20, 2014 7:33 pm

Hi Ilona

Let me start with the last question
What comes up for you, if you hear- there is no I?
Nothing much really
Perhaps a smile, but that's it.

catch me on a different day and perhaps i'll look you in the eyes and say "Yes, so?"
but not today. today i'm just smiling.

What happened? ?
I came back for india after meeting a yogi who refused to teach me. He told me that I was addicted to seeking, and when I realized he was right, I stopped my search and returned back home. The search exhausted itself, and then spontaneously one evening back in the US I asked "Who am I?". For one instant I experienced myself directly, and that was it. Never went back.
What changed ?
The biggest change. I stopped seeking.
I had a deep appreciation for life, and there was nothing in me that was looking for meaning anymore.
Meaning revealed itself for the fixation that it is. Existence by itself was enough, and I no longer was looking for anything outside of it. There was no creator, and I didn't feel like life came from somewhere. It is what it is, and that was enough.

Once a friend asked me ""What did you come here (into this life) for?"
I replied "From where?". He was asking me about meaning, and I wasn't looking for any, that was clear.

Suddenly, everything was included. whether it was inanimate or animate, worldly or spirit, experiential or symbolic. All were just different expressions of the same thing. Some like to call it emptiness, I like to call it life or the animated force.

There was no separate identity, but there was a recognition of a fundamental identity. the fundamental identity of all things, an identity that didn't own and could never be owned.

Ownership fell away. Meaning fell away. This was all a very deep and fundamental change in perception.

Life was all that is, and it was living a 'me', and there was no 'I' that was living it. This was clear.
What didn't change ?
Surprisingly, my personality and the way I interacted didn't change.
I still had the same relationships, same challenges, same aches and pains as before.

prior to the realization there was this dream that once I realize things would become easier
they didn't.

I still needed to do my work, and I still needed to put in the time and effort, except that it was also clear, that it was not 'I' that was doing the work, and there was no 'I' that was putting in the effort.

I wish I could explain this in greater detail, but it's difficult
Things were the same, and at the same time they were not.

Life was the source and the destination, and though I continued to develop myself further
I was not longer developing myself to enhance my sense of self, but rather developing to dissolve it even further.

Even the sense of self didn't really just go away. Instead it was just seen for what it really was.
A periphery confused for a center. An effect confused for a cause. A promise with an inability to ever deliver.
What's next ?
For three years I have been contemplating on "How?"

Crossing the bridge, and things seem so evident "Of course there is no 'I' that wills its own activities",
but for others there is an 'I' and a bridge that they cannot seem to cross.

i'm slowly learning how the mind can be approached. I'm learning what works and what does not
learning from my own mistakes.

the goal - to eventually be able to approach the mind gently and directly enough so that it does continue running around escaping what to me seems so evident, and clear. Learning to sustain it on direct experience.

i've spent years waking up, and naturally I would like to be in service to others like me, and eventually to everyone else.

What's next is what was before - The joy of Inquiry. Life.
-- ozpicious

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Re: The living question

Postby Ilona » Fri Feb 21, 2014 2:20 pm

Thank you very much for answers, it was a pleasure to read them. It's great that seeking is over!
If you would like to help with guiding, you are most welcome. We have Facebook groups that you can join and learn how we do that.
I will send you a pm, which will tell you how to get to the groups.

Lots of love.

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